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The night the Palestinian Authority showed us whose side it is on

The violence meted out by PA forces against Palestinian demonstrators Wednesday night was unlike anything I’ve ever experienced. When it was all over, one thing became clear: the PA isn’t a subcontractor of the occupation, they are in lock step.

Palestinians in Ramallah demonstrate against the Palestinian Authority's sanctions on Gaza, June 13, 2018. (ارفعوا العقوبات)

Palestinians in central Ramallah demonstrate against the Palestinian Authority’s sanctions on Gaza, June 13, 2018. (ارفعوا العقوبات)

Having just witnessed her friend’s arrest, and frustrated by her failure to prevent it, a young activist stood in front of a line of police officers, defenseless, and instinctively shouted, “With spirit, with blood, we’ll redeem you Gaza.” Members of the Palestinian security forces, dressed in civilian clothes, knocked her to the ground. Two policemen joined in and began kicking the bleeding, terrified woman.

This was just one of the many scenes of violence meted out by the Palestinian Authority’s security forces against Palestinian demonstrators who had gathered in the center of Ramallah Wednesday night to demand an end to the PA’s sanctions against Gaza. It was the second such demonstration in the span of a week.

The first demonstration, on Sunday, was relatively uneventful, but on Wednesday the PA’s response was severe: police arrested 69 activists, some of whom were arrested after the protest while they were receiving treatment for their wounds in the hospital. Security forces attacked journalists, women, the elderly, and bystanders, confiscating and breaking cameras and phones. Meanwhile, groups of Fatah youth dressed in civilian clothes infiltrated the protest and meted out their own violence.

The trip to Ramallah, on a bus carrying activists from Haifa, went smoothly. But upon our arrival at Manara Square, we found an unexpectedly large number of Palestinian security forces: hundreds of armed, uniformed security forces — some in police uniforms, some special forces, others in military uniforms with balaclavas covering their faces. Everyone there that night understood that there were also members of secret police — dressed in civilian clothes — circulating among the demonstrators.

The police had preemptively declared the demonstration illegal the previous morning. According to the PA, the reason was “the desire not to disturb the residents of the city in their preparation for the upcoming Iftar celebration.” The protest was supposed to start at 9:30 p.m., but police prevented demonstrators from gathering in the square. Then suddenly, the police moved with great force toward one of the streets that split off from the square, and began firing stun grenades and tear gas toward the protesters.

I took out my phone to document what was happening. Security forces, their faces covered, ran toward me with M-16s raised. I froze, but continued to take photos. One of the officers grabbed and arrested someone standing close to me. Then, out of nowhere, I felt a sudden, painful blow to my back that knocked me forward.

The policeman who kicked me from behind, dressed in a blue uniform, called over to his friends, and the the two pounced on me and my phone was able to comprehend what was happening. Confiscating my phone was just the start.

The policeman who kicked me began to confiscate phones, stripping them out of the hands of people standing next me, even if they weren’t taking pictures. All of my requests to get my phone back were answered with curses and yells. I realized I had a problem.

Palestinian protesters flee from tear gas fired by Palestinian Authority's police forces during a demonstration against the PA's sanctions on Gaza, June 13, 2018. (ارفعوا العقوبات)

Palestinian protesters flee from tear gas fired by Palestinian Authority’s police forces during a demonstration against the PA’s sanctions on Gaza, June 13, 2018. (ارفعوا العقوبات)

Taysir, a friend from Qalandia Refugee Camp who was standing beside me, looked even more worried. “It’s not so bad,” I told him. “I’ll get the phone back.”

“I’m not so sure,” he said in a battle-worn tone, despite his young age. “They’re animals, Rami. They break phones and cameras then throw them out.”

Suddenly, we heard a shriek. PA forces with their faces covered were returning from the square with several arrestees. We saw some of them being beaten while the officers marched them up the street. We watched, mouths agape. “I cannot believe they are this violent — these are Palestinian police, not Israeli soldiers,” I said to Taysir. He smiled bitterly and told me to forget it. “It’s only going to get worse. Come with me to the camp, it will be safer there tonight.”

PA police forces seen during a demonstration in central Ramallah against the PA's sanctions against Gaza, June 13, 2018. (Adlan Mansri)

PA police forces seen during a demonstration in central Ramallah against the PA’s sanctions against Gaza, June 13, 2018. (Adlan Mansri)

He was right. Determined to clear the streets, large groups of Palestinian security forces moved toward and targeted with tear gas and stun grenades any gathering of even a few people. Out of each group of protesters, they would grab at least one person — sometimes shocking them with devices that reminded me of a cattle prod.

Then came the undercover officers.

Among the protesters were also youth from Jalazun, a refugee camp strongly identified with Fatah. Suddenly, all together, they pulled out and put on baseball caps with the image of a keffiyeh printed on them, and began to arrest demonstrators in cooperation with the security forces. That’s when I knew the gates of hell were about to open.

A Palestinian holds the remains of a stun grenade during an anti-PA demonstration in central Ramallah, June 13, 2018. (PA police forces seen during a demonstration in central Ramallah against the PA's sanctions against Gaza, June 13, 2018. (Adlan Mansri)

A Palestinian holds the remains of a stun grenade during an anti-PA demonstration in central Ramallah, June 13, 2018. (PA police forces seen during a demonstration in central Ramallah against the PA’s sanctions against Gaza, June 13, 2018. (Adlan Mansri)

I have been to many protests over the years, including ones where live gunfire was used against protesters. But I had never felt fear like that which I felt on Wednesday in Ramallah.

The presence of undercover police meant the beatings and arrests could come from any direction, and that is exactly what happened. Despite the police’s orders to disperse, there was nowhere to escape to. Shocked, I stood completely frozen. Time stopped as chaos unfolded around me: a woman was beaten badly before my eyes; no one among the hundreds of people nearby dared to help her. Others were arrested and led like animals by the Fatah youth. The police arrested tens of people, some of whom they threw to the ground. Some of us nearly suffocated from the tear gas.

I somehow managed to cross over to an adjacent street. At that moment, a group of young women, most of them journalists, passed by. One of them dared to chant in support of Gaza — not against Abbas or Fatah, but for Gaza. A stun grenade was thrown at their feet within seconds. A few moments later I meet a friend from Ramallah with tears in her eyes. “What happened?” I asked, “did they beat you?”

“I wish. One of the officers told me ‘what are you doing in the street, you whore? Get out of here immediately.’”

Tear gas is fired at Palestinian protesters in central Ramallah, June 13, 2018. (ارفعوا العقوبات)

Tear gas is fired at Palestinian protesters in central Ramallah, June 13, 2018. (ارفعوا العقوبات)

At this point I decided I had enough. I had to go to the police station to see what happened to the detainees.

Among those arrested was Munhad Abu Ghosh, a well-known anti-Abbas activist from Haifa. Upon his release (at the time of publishing, only five of those arrested were still being held), he described the threats he says he has received from Abbas supporters in months past. “They said they would send a junkie to take care of me in Haifa. It would only cost them $100-200.”

“At a certain point they told me that if I come to Ramallah, the Tanzim (a militant faction of the Fatah movement – r.y.) would shoot me in the legs, and an investigation will be conducted only for the sake of appearances,” he continued. That last threat, he said, was delivered only a couple of months ago.

Abu Ghosh is part of a growing group of Palestinian citizens of Israel who are very critical of Abbas and the PA, and who regularly participate in protests in the West Bank.

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“[The PA] isn’t only using mafia tactics, they are taking advantage of these young people from the refugee camps (young Fatah activists from Jalazun refugee camp — r.y.),” he continued. “For them, beating up people here is an act of conquering a city to which they never felt a sense of belonging. Fatah is cynically exploiting the poverty and exclusion of Palestinian refugees. Those same kids, many of them under 20, have no idea what they did yesterday and how they were exploited.”

At the police station, I went between pleading with the policemen to return my phone and speaking with the families of the detainees who were standing outside, desperate for any information. The police refused to give any answers. At 2 a.m., still in pain from being kicked in the back, I found myself in a political argument with dozens of police officers. The brainwashing they had undergone was clear. When I accused them of using violence against activists, their responses were, “the protesters received money” or “this was a Hamas protest.” Abbas’ forces easily adopt Israeli propaganda, it seems. According to the stories they tell themselves, that many of those arrested were actually left-wing students from Bir Zeit University is not really important.

Despairing and in pain, I continued on to the next police station. By that time it was 3 a.m. I finally located by phone but then I encountered an unexpected obstacle — the duty officer refused to let me enter the station because I was wearing shorts. I began to lose it. “You came from Haifa with your shorts to protest here and intervene in our politics?” the policeman said to me. I couldn’t help but think of what the mayor of Haifa, Yona Yahav, had said after policy violently repressed a protest there a few weeks earlier: “Arabs from outside the city” had come to “disturb co-existence in the city.”

Israeli riot police arrest a protester in downtown Haifa during a demonstration against the mass killings in Gaza, May 19, 2018. (Nadine Nashef)

Israeli riot police arrest a protester in downtown Haifa during a demonstration against the mass killings in Gaza, May 19, 2018. (Nadine Nashef)

That’s when I finally understood. The Palestinian Authority is not a subcontractor of the occupation. The Palestinian Authority is a full partner in implementing every Israeli tactic in oppressing the Palestinian people.

Suddenly, the beatings against the women who chanted in support of Gaza seemed logical. On Wednesday night, the PA announced openly and practically: just like Israel, we are against Gaza.

This article was first published in Hebrew on Local Call. Read it here.

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    COMMENTS

    1. Jeff Blankfort

      The Palestinian Authority, from Mahmoud Abbas on down is and has been for some years, a critical arm of the Israeli security establishment and it and the traitors under their control have been able to function in the way we see in this protest because Palestinians in the diaspora and non-Palestinians who support the struggle for justice in Palestine have looked the other way and allowed the traitors to get away with it. They can’t even acknowledge Abbas’s complicity in cutting down the electricity for the besieged of Gaza. There is absolutely no valid excuse for this.

      Those who are serious should look to the Irish Republican Army for lessons on how to handle traitors. An intifada against the PA is long overdue.

      Reply to Comment
    2. Tony Riley

      What a pathetic article. The PA take your phone, and break up an illegal demo, organised by Hamas, and you blame Israel.

      If your girlfriend broke up with you, you would blame Israel.

      Why not write an article asking why no Israeli Arab citizens ever claim asylum in any of the fabulous Arab democracies in the region?

      Why don’t you claim asylum in Syria: it’s where your family originated?

      Reply to Comment
    3. Ben

      ” Like any dictatorship (or Kleptocracy in this case) the PA will violently stop any and all kind of protest against them or what they perceive as a threat to their power.”

      Riley completely misses the point. Younis is not “blaming Israel” in Riley’s contemptuous and victim-playing nonsense–whether due to playing dumb or to simple fatuousness, it hardly matters.

      So does Geller. Geller, we have news for you. (1) Unlike you, +972 Magazine has always been for human rights and against oppression and injustice, whether committed by Jews or Arabs or South Africans or Chinese or Burmese. They don’t make exceptions based on race and ethnicity. (2) Guess what? Like any dictatorship and organized crime outfit the Israeli occupying power will violently stop any and all kind of protest against them or what they perceive as a threat to their power. When Palestinians protest against Abbas it’s humans yearning for freedom but when they protest against Netanyahu its “terror.” We understand how this works.

      Reply to Comment
      • Ido

        Ben, as usual you completely disregarded what I wrote, the evidence I provided and my actual point, mainly the writer’s comparison.
        “So does Geller.” – So you missed the bit where he writes “Abbas’ forces easily adopt Israeli propaganda” ?
        Never mind that I proved with lots of evidence how what is happening is nothing new as it is a modus operandi of the PA, same as any dictatorship, or Kleptocracy in this case. Same as Hamas, a brutal theocracy. His comparison of the PA to Israel is very wrong and I explained it, very clearly so. That was actually my point if you read the last paragraph again.
        “Unlike you, +972 Magazine has always been for human rights” – so you gloss over all the lies, misinformation and anti-Israel propaganda they publish as fact ? just like you gloss over all the evidence I provide to refute your nonsense ?
        “They don’t make exceptions based on race and ethnicity” – they do seem to adopt Palestinian lies and anti-Israel propaganda with vigor. I sometimes point it out like I did with this article, the author’s comparison is ridiculous. The author isn’t aware of some of the basic facts, what the PA is doing is nothing new, etc. I provided evidence for everything I said, would you like to address it ? challenge it ?
        “the Israeli occupying power will violently stop any and all kind of protest against them or what they perceive as a threat to their power” – factually incorrect. Are you even aware of the protests in Israel against the government ? again Netanyahu ?
        You’re comparison is laughable, you’re lying again.
        “but when they protest against Netanyahu its “terror.” We understand how this works” – prove it. Back up your nonsense. Show me where an anti-Netanyahu protest was labeled as terrorism and the protesters were handled accordingly like your laughable comparison.

        Reply to Comment
        • Ben

          Sometimes you read right wing trolls here and you have to read it twice to be sure they really wrote what they did because you can’t believe even they would say that and then you look again and realize, yes, they really mean it, and you realize how astonishingly little they know, want to know and want to understand. And you can’t make this stuff up.

          “First, the violence of the PA is nothing new, apparently the writer wasn’t aware of this.”

          Here Geller takes his absolutely inane patronizing to new heights, lecturing Rami Younis of all people, on the PA and violence and presuming Rami was not aware the PA has been violent before. As I said, you can’t make this stuff up.

          As if he completely misses Rami’s whole point, that this was an escalation and a reaffirmed total commitment to and heightening of violence and police state tactics, a declaration, against Palestinians on behalf of a corrupt PA and on behalf of the Israeli authorities both. (Was Quisling acting on behalf of Quisling too or just on behalf of the invaders of Norway?) And Geller completely twists Rami’s sophisticated and intelligent essay into some simple-minded exercise in sheer stupidity: “Hey!, duh!, the PA is violent!, well whaddayaknow, gee willikers I never knew that because I’m a moron who lives somewhere else and not someone who has been to more protests in one week than Geller in his entire life!”)

          Did I say you can’t make this stuff up? It is a measure of the kind of person attracted to trolling for right wing Israel that we get to read these hapless, inadvertently comic productions.

          Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            “Are you even aware of the protests in Israel against the government ?”

            More astonishingly patronizing nonsense from Ido Geller.

            As should have been quite clear from the phrase, “the Israeli occupying power,” I was not referring to protests against cottage cheese and housing prices west of the green line, but since you didn’t get that, let me make it clear: ‘when they protest against Netanyahu it’s “terror”’ was shorthand for ‘when Palestinians protest against Netanyahu’s occupation regime it’s “terror”’

            Your patronizing boggles the mind. It is a measure of how little YOU understand and how little, therefore, you infer that WE understand.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            “More astonishingly patronizing nonsense from Ido Geller” – yes, pointing out a fact: this violence is nothing new, is ‘patronizing’. Hilarious.
            “when Palestinians protest against Netanyahu’s occupation regime it’s “terror” – I’m glad you asked this because this brings us to a question you ignored literally a dozen times and more:
            Please explain how violent riots including gunfire, firebombs, Molotov Cocktails, mortar fire, fire kites and attempts to breach the border, all well documented, are “peaceful civil unarmed protests” ?
            “Your patronizing boggles the mind” – you’re clueless bias, denial of reality and habit of repeatedly ignoring facts and evidence not to your liking is a source of endless amusement. Even when said evidence is the Palestinian leadership themselves or their spokespersons yelling it to your face repeatedly. Amazing. I wonder how you excuse this to yourself.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            “Here Geller takes his absolutely inane patronizing to new heights” – I stated a fact. I proved it with evidence. Extreme violence used by the Palestinian Authority’s security forces against Palestinian demonstrators is nothing new.
            The writer didn’t seem to be aware of this fact. Are you going to address said evidence ? do you think it’s wrong ?
            “lecturing Rami Younis of all people” – Yes, it’s preposterous to think his memory will be selective and tilt towards pro-Palestinian propaganda, right ? again: everything I said was backed by proof. is the evidence inaccurate ?
            “presuming Rami was not aware the PA has been violent before” – By his own words he seems quite surprised by it, was that part written by someone else ? and I quote:
            “We watched, mouths agape. I cannot believe they are this violent — these are Palestinian police, not Israeli soldiers”, “PA forces against Palestinian demonstrators Wednesday night was unlike anything I’ve ever experienced”.
            I linked to examples showing this behavior by the PA is nothing new. How can you not understand this ?
            “As if he completely misses Rami’s whole point” – I literally quoted his point and refuted his nonsense, are you blind ? “”just like Israel, the Palestinian Authority is against Gaza”, “the PA isn’t a subcontractor of the occupation, they are in lock step”.
            How can you miss this ?
            “this was an escalation” – no it wasn’t, the PA behaved like this before, this is nothing new. and I provided evidence to support this claim which you, of course, ignored. I didn’t even got to the torture part, would you like to read about that ?
            This is the inner conflict between Hamas and Fatah. That’s it.
            “Was Quisling acting on behalf of Quisling too or just on behalf of the invaders of Norway?” – irrelevant but amusing. Are you not aware of the inner Palestinian conflict between Fatah and Hamas ? are you that detached from reality ?
            “And Geller completely twists Rami’s sophisticated and intelligent essay” – I always love it when you end with a hearty joke, this time you outdone yourself.
            “never knew that” – the author, by his own words, seemed to be surprised by the violence of the PA. Would you like me to quote him again ?
            “Did I say you can’t make this stuff up?” – just proved everything you said is either a lie, a product of bad reading comprehension or just the regular delusional bias.
            Would you like me to link to the mass of posts on other articles proving in great detail how you’re a clueless liar who has no idea what he’s talking about ? you know, the ones you ignore ? always an entertaining read. Your effort to avoid evidence proving you wrong repeatedly must be excruciating.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            OK, I think people can see how no honest conversation is possible with this person. I rest my case. Quod erat demonstrandum.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Ben: “I rest my case” – I just proved in detail how you were wrong. Hilarious. My quotes of the writer are wrong ? are you going to address the evidence I provided ? anything to back up your nonsense ?
            Are you going to actually answer this question: please explain how violent riots including gunfire, firebombs, Molotov Cocktails, mortar fire, fire kites and attempts to breach the border, all well documented, are “peaceful civil unarmed protests” ?
            Why is this so hard for you to do ?
            It’s hilarious when you say “no honest conversation is possible with this person” after I point out your lies and denial of reality again and you again refuse to address the evidence I provide or answer the question you ignore repeatedly which will force you to face your delusional nonsense.

            Reply to Comment
    4. Bruce Gould

      @Ido: I have two – count ’em! two – simple questions for you:

      In what ways, specifically, does Israel exert control over Gaza?

      What difference have you observed between Hamas’ original charter and the most recently revised version?

      Reply to Comment
      • Ido

        “In what ways, specifically, does Israel exert control over Gaza?” – the land, air, and sea blockade (other than the border with Egypt, which is not under Israel’s control) as a response to constant attacks from Gaza, ruled by an Islamic Jihadist terrorist organization which calls for the elimination of Israel and the murder of Jews.
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blockade_of_the_Gaza_Strip

        “What difference have you observed between Hamas’ original charter and the most recently revised version?” – none as Hamas’ “new charter” did not change its basic premise and they still call for the elimination of Israel, they still consider all of Israel as theirs.
        The difference is an addition to appeal to Western ‘Useful Idiots’ by saying Hamas accepts a Palestinian state on the pre-1967 lines however if you read all of it you’ll see their goals regarding Israel remain the same:
        https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/10213/hamas-new-charter

        Reply to Comment
        • Bruce Gould

          @Ido: “Terrorist”. I think that any objective observer would have to say that Israel has committed many acts of terror. There was terrorism in 1948 (see Ari Shavit’s article on Lydda in the New Yorker), there was terror in 1967 (when Moshe Dayan somehow convinced 200,000+ Palestinian civilians to leave their homes), there was loads of terror in the Lebanon wars (the journalist Robert Fisk was there), terror continues to this day. Maybe ‘terrorist’ is just no longer a useful word?

          Why not take the advice of many in the Israeli military and make efforts to negotiate with Hamas?

          Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Bruce, everything Israel did was a response. A response to the actions of terrorists who openly and very clearly claim their goal is the elimination of Israel and the murder of Jews. There would be no blockade if Hamas didn’t declare “Jihad” and attacked Israel, there was no blockade in 2005 following Israel’s complete withdrawal
            from Gaza. Why do you treat the Palestinians like children with no responsibility for their own actions ?
            “There was terrorism in 1948” – there were also massacres and terrorism committed by the Arabs on the Jews back then, are you not aware of this ? actions and response.
            “there was terror in 1967” – there was also a genocidal attempt to eradicate Israel and to slaughter the Jews. Are you not aware of this ?
            “Moshe Dayan somehow convinced 200,000+ Palestinian” – please elaborate.
            “there was loads of terror in the Lebanon wars” – be specific. You intentionally ignore the reason the wars started ? terrorist attacks by the PLO ? Iraqi-backed Abu Nidal ? the cross-border shellings on Israeli cities ? you seem to be very selective in your memory.
            “terror continues to this day” – and the Palestinians spell out to you why that is: Israel exists. The homeland of the Jews exists. Both Palestinian leadership factions are spelling it out for you. Them and the Arab/Islamic countries which fund and support them.
            “Maybe ‘terrorist’ is just no longer a useful word?” – Maybe you have no idea what Hamas are and what are their stated objectives? the religious justifications for their actions ? the goal of Fatah ? Islamic Jihad ? etc ?
            “Why not take the advice of many in the Israeli military and make efforts to negotiate with Hamas?” – about what exactly ? their preferred methods of ending Israel ? you seem not to be aware what Hamas are and what are their intentions, why any kind of compromise that will allow a viable Israel to exist is unacceptable to them. I explained this in detail in the Facebook comments section in the following link and the comments below including addressing ‘the advice of many in the Israeli military’:
            https://972mag.com/if-trump-talks-with-north-korea-why-should-the-u-s-boycott-hamas/136036/

            Reply to Comment
          • Bruce Gould

            @Ido: 1967, 1982. Ido, have you read any Israeli historians?

            https://www.wrmea.org/1990-march/israeli-terror-tactics-drive-out-palestinians-in-1948-and-1967.html

            The brutal Israeli Army tactics which triggered the little-known “second exodus” from Palestine, emptying such camps as Aqabat Jabr and Ein Sultan, may be repeated in further mass expulsions in the 1990s. Prime Minister Yitzhak Shamir has said publicly that Israel needs the West Bank for Soviet Jews. Does a third exodus to “cleanse” the West Bank and Gaza Strip entirely of Palestinians lie ahead?

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            OK two days have passed, they’re either censoring me again or it’s taking longer than usual. If you don’t mind I’ll post my response in the Facebook comments section.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            @Bruce: I think you are seeing how an honest and meaningful conversation with this person is simply not possible. Everything Jews do is the “response” of a victim, everything Arabs do is the original sin. And Jews change and evolve, but Arabs are implacable fiends; who write stupid things in response to which he has to serve them with astonishingly patronizing and condescending lectures.)

            (Now, he’ll say I am unfairly describing his thought (he won’t put it that nicely) but I will say I am simply summarizing it by stripping if of its verbosity, pretense and self-serving double talk. And I’m guessing he and I will disagree on this. It’s just a guess, you never know.)

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            “I think you are seeing how an honest and meaningful conversation with this person is simply not possible” – I answered both his questions and backed my answers with evidence. I have no idea why you’re lying about this as well.
            “Everything Jews do is the “response” of a victim” – I literally pointed out what were the reasons, you, of course, ignored it.
            “everything Arabs do is the original sin” – and you’re lying again. I was very specific including pointing out how Israel’s very existence is the reason for Hamas/Fatah actions and goals. If you’re going to make stuff up, at least try to be somewhat grounded in reality, even though evidently you have a very tenuous grasp on what that is.
            “And Jews change and evolve, but Arabs are implacable fiends” – and some more lies. I never said anything of the sort, everything I said about the goals and actions of the Palestinian leadership I backed it with evidence which you never challenged. Would you like to now ? I’m all ears.
            “Now, he’ll say I am unfairly describing his thought” – no, you’re just lying again.

            Reply to Comment
          • Bruce Gould

            @Ido: “Why not take the advice of many in the Israeli military and make efforts to negotiate with Hamas?” – about what exactly ? their preferred methods of ending Israel ?

            You tell me what the IDF generals think they can achieve by negotiating with Hamas. For years now they’ve been suggesting negotiations, they’ve sent a letter to Netanyahu about this, they’ve formed organizations to promote exactly things like negotiations – what are they thinking? Are you actually not aware of all this?

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            “You tell me what the IDF generals think they can achieve by negotiating with Hamas” – already did, in the link I provided. A “hudna”, to delay the next round of attacks.
            “what are they thinking? Are you actually not aware of all this?” – they are aware, Hamas are not exactly hiding their goals and actions. They simply prefer a short term solution, like I already explained.
            There are generals who disagree with them of course.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            That you “back” anything with “evidence” is of course the conceit that lies at the heart of the matter. “I have no idea why you’re lying” and other shallow techniques have never convinced anybody around here and they are not going to magically start convincing people now.

            Got any “evidence” to “back” a response to “1967, 1982…brutal Israeli Army tactics…second exodus…mass expulsions…”?

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            “That you “back” anything with “evidence” – and I ask again: which fact or linked evidence I provided is wrong ? please by all means point to it, back up your claims. Why is this so hard for you ?
            “and other shallow techniques” – I literally quote you lying and prove it, over and over again. You think lying about this as well is somehow going to cancel it out ?
            “Got any “evidence” to “back” a response to “1967, 1982…brutal Israeli Army tactics…second exodus…mass expulsions…”?” – I already wrote the post but since it has a few links with evidence it will probably take 2 days for it to appear.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            More shallow techniques. More exercises in inanity. Ground Hog Day.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Oh yeah, asking you which fact or linked evidence I provided is wrong and for you to back up your claims or address my posts where I point in detail where you’re wrong and where you lied again is unreasonable. It’s “a shallow technique” and “exercises in inanity”. You’re like an endless fountain of hilarity, thanks for the laugh.

            Reply to Comment
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