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IDF refuses to say what it's doing to avoid killing more journalists

Israeli snipers have killed two Palestinian journalists and shot at least 20 others in Gaza in recent months. What happened to the soldiers responsible? What is the IDF doing to make sure it doesn’t happen again? The army refuses to say.

Palestinians takes part in a protest against the killing of journalist Yasser Murtaja in Rafah, near the Israel-Gaza border, Gaza Strip, April 8, 2018. (Abed Rahim Khatib/ Flash90)

Palestinian journalists stage a protest against the killing of fellow journalist Yaser Murtaja in Rafah, near the Israel-Gaza border, Gaza Strip, April 8, 2018. (Abed Rahim Khatib/ Flash90)

Nearly two months after Israeli army snipers shot and killed two Palestinian journalists while they were reporting inside the Gaza Strip, the military is refusing to answer any questions about whether the responsible soldiers and commanders are being held accountable in any way.

Over the past two weeks, +972 Magazine has contacted the IDF Spokesperson’s Office five times with the following questions: What investigative actions have been taken into the two killings? Has a decision to charge or discipline the soldiers involved been reached? And, is the army is planning any changes to its standing orders or regulations in order to prevent other journalists from being killed or shot in similar situations.

Although the Spokesperson’s Office acknowledged receiving the questions, it ignored them and refused to answer on all five occasions.

On April 6, 2018, an Israeli army sniper shot photojournalist Yaser Murtaja while he was reporting on the Great Return March protests inside the Gaza Strip. According to numerous witnesses who spoke with a range of media outlets in the days and weeks since, Murtaja was wearing a vest clearly visible “PRESS” vest when he was shot. Israeli soldiers shot and wounded at least a handful of other journalists were shot and wounded that day. He died of his wounds the next day.

Mourners and fellow journalists carry the body of Yasser Murtaja at his funeral in Gaza City, April 7, 2018. Murtaja was shot and killed by Israeli soldiers during the Great Return March in the southern Gaza Strip. (Mohammed Zaanoun/Activestills.org)

Mourners and fellow journalists carry the body of Yaser Murtaja at his funeral in Gaza City, April 7, 2018. Murtaja was shot and killed by Israeli soldiers during the Great Return March in the southern Gaza Strip. (Mohammed Zaanoun/Activestills.org)

A week later, on April 13, 2018, an Israeli army sniper shot Ahmed Abu Hussein, who was also wearing a “PRESS” vest as he was reporting at the weekly protests inside the Gaza Strip. Two weeks later, he died in an Israeli hospital, where he had been transferred due to the severity of his wounds.

The army has not expressed any remorse for killing the two journalists, although military spokespeople did state that journalists were not deliberately shot. Nevertheless, hours after Murtaja was killed, Israeli Defense Minister Avigdor Liberman accused him of being a Hamas operative, a claim that was largely refuted by reporting on the ground, including by the fact that Murtaja had recently been vetted by the U.S. State Department.

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According to the Committee to Protect Journalists (CPJ), Israeli troops have shot at least 22 Palestinian journalists with live fire since the protests in Gaza began on March 30. In total, Israeli troops have killed at least 128 people since the start of the Great Return March, according to the Gaza Health Ministry, and more than 3,500 others have been wounded from live fire. Last Friday, soldiers shot and killed 21-year-old medic Razan al-Najjar while she was trying to evacuate wounded protesters.

The Israeli High Court of Justice recently upheld the rules of engagement that the army has been using to shoot those thousands of people in Gaza these past months. The decision was premised on the army’s assurances that high ranking officers approve each time its snipers target anyone and that it only uses live ammunition as a last resort. Writing in the Times of Israel, a man who says he was stationed on the Gaza border as an Israeli army reservist in recent months, wrote that the army was so meticulous with its sniper fire that “every bullet and every hit is carefully reported, documented and investigated, in Excel spreadsheets. Literally.”

Considering the army’s insistence that it did not shoot dozens of journalists deliberately and that it “know[s] where every bullet landed,” one might think it would see fit to be a little transparent with regards to what it is doing about the fact that its soldiers have shot at least 22 journalists in recent months, killing two.

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    COMMENTS

    1. Bruce Gould

      On the topic of Israeli snipers shooting journalists or clearly unarmed protesters, Breaking The Silence has issued a statement:

      http://www.breakingthesilence.org.il/inside/how-not-to-disperse-demonstrations/

      Testimonies from dozens of soldiers who served in the Gaza Strip in the recent rounds of violence indicate a grave but clear picture – this is not mistaken misconduct, but rather a systematic open fire policy. The IDF’s attempts to retroactively incriminate demonstrators by deeming them Hamas activists, will not change the intolerable ease with which it fired at dozens of unarmed people, who were neither on lists of wanted persons, nor were they intelligence targets, and most of them didn’t seem to be endangering lives.

      Reply to Comment
    2. Ben

      ‘…Masses of unarmed human beings, men, women and children, braved the Israeli sharpshooters. They did not draw weapons. They did not “storm the fence”, a lie spread by the huge Israeli propaganda apparatus. They stood exposed to the sharpshooters and were killed…’
      http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/avnery/1527857702/

      Reply to Comment
      • Ido

        Ben, so the videos of the riots at the border are fake ? the gunfire, Molotov cocktails, slingshots, firebombs, fire kites, etc are the hallmarks of “non-violent unarmed resistance” ? the fact that tens of thousands of protesters, who really did participate in a non-violent protests, were not harmed is purely a coincidence ?

        Regarding your link: Mr. Avnery need psychiatric attention.
        He spent many happy hours with Hamas terrorist Mahmoud al-Zahar. I’m sure al-Zahar adores Avnery. It’s great to find such a glorious specimen of a ‘Useful Idiot’ who apparently is not aware what Hamas are and what are their ideology.
        How he speaks about arch-terrorist Jew murderer Yasser Arafat with such affection, the man most responsible for the Palestinians refusal to accept any kind of co-existence with Israel, the man who came up with the ‘Phased Plan’ for Israel’s elimination.
        The man who co-founded the terrorist organization Fatah for the disestablishment of Israel and its replacement with a Palestinian state.
        I like how Avnery lies about Arafat as being ‘son of a Gazan family’ when he was actually born to an Egyptian family in Egypt and lied all his life that he wasn’t.
        He met “friendly attitude everywhere in the Gaza Strip”. I wouldn’t expect them to treat a delusional ‘Useful Idiot’ of his caliber any differently.
        “Everywhere we talked about peace and about the place of Gaza in the future State of Palestine” – odd that he neglect to mention that Israel and the Jews are not exactly part of the picture as the Palestinian leadership, both Fatah and Hamas, state very clearly.
        The man apparently doesn’t consider Hamas, an Islamic Jihadist genocidal terrorist organization who calls for the elimination of Israel and the slaughter of Jews, as a terrorist organization. Like I said I think he means well but he should be helped by medical professionals. He lost touch with reality.
        Avnery lies about the Gaza withdrawal, it wasn’t as he say “to cut all ties with the Gaza Strip”. He ignored that Hamas were elected by the people of Gaza, he ignored the inner conflict of Fatah with Hamas, the fact that the PLO did control Gaza before Hamas threw them out, he lies bout the origin of Hamas, he
        lies about why the blockade exist, he lies about the Mavi Marmara, ignoring for some reason how the people on board attacked the Israelis on it, he lies about Egypt’s own agenda regarding their border with Gaza, how they were also attacked at the border, he neglects to mention Egypt’s
        dealings with the Muslim Brotherhood had to do with them trying to turn Egypt into another Islamic theocracy by Morsi’s power grab which lead to mass protests.
        Some of his nonsense is hilarious: “Thus the Gaza Strip remains almost completely isolated, without friends. Except some idealists around the world” – yes, besides Iran, Qatar and Saudi Arabia who fund Hamas and send them weapons.
        The Iranian missiles fired on my Family did not materialize out of thin air.

        “Gazan organizations carry out violent acts, which do no real damage to the State of Israel” – the guy is insane. terrorist attacks, bombed cities with thousands of missiles and rockets and burned fields are nothing at all, a mere nuisance.
        “And then the Palestinians discovered a new weapon: non-violent resistance” – oh yes, we saw what apparently passes for ‘non-violent resistance’ for Gaza. The guy should do comedy.
        “The world saw a picture of a little boy shot while in the arms of his father” – OK so either he does not know the boy was killed by the Palestinians in a crossfire as the physical evidence of the shooting was in all ways inconsistent with shots coming from the IDF outpost.
        or he’s deliberately lying. I would like to think he’s simply clueless.
        Well, Avnery is right about one thing, I’ll give him that: “There is no such tradition in the Muslim world of non-violent resistance”.
        “the demonstrators on the Gaza border are now finding this power in their hearts” – hilarious. Is he demented or he simply not aware what is actually going on at the border ? directed by his “great friends” the genocidal Jihadist terrorists Hamas ?
        “hundred mortar shells into Israel without causing any real damage” – sure, people ran to their bomb shelters for the 15 seconds the have to do so. So he is troubled that there were no dead Jews ?
        “Hamas has offered a Hudna” – Apparently Avnery doesn’t know what ‘Hudna’ means in the Islamic culture. He should read about the Hudaibiya treaty. If he thinks it’ll end any differently than the previous “Hudna” he’s more delusional than I thought.
        He mentions Muslims respecting ‘Hudna’ during the crusades without understanding the meaning and the reason. The treaty is kept as long as the Muslims are not in a position of power to wage war.
        “A Hudna is a sacred armistice, which no Muslim is allowed to break” – no it isn’t Mr. Avnery, you have no clue. It’s the exact opposite as dictated by Islamic tradition from the days of Muhammed.
        He concluded with “MY HEART is with the people of Gaza”, I don’t doubt it, so is mine. What Hamas is doing is destroying them. Too bad Mr. Avnery’s mind is long gone.

        Reply to Comment
        • Bruce Gould

          @Ido: Uri Avnery understands where the Gazans come from – he was there in 48. Better column by Avnery:

          http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/avnery/1526725578/

          I asked myself: what would I have done if I had been a youngster of 15 in the Gaza Strip? My answer was, without hesitation: I would have stood near the border fence and demonstrated, risking my life and limbs every minute. How am I so sure? Simple: I did the same when I was 15. I was a member of the National Military Organization (the “Irgun”), an armed underground group labeled “terrorist”.

          Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Bruce, read my post. The man is demented. He lost touch with reality, as I explained in great detail in relation to the article he posted. No wonder Jihadist genocidal terrorists like Hamas adore him. He’s the best specimen of ‘Useful Idiot’ they could ever wish for.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            ” The man is demented…as I explained in great detail.”

            You gotta love that “as I explained.” It’s so Geller! “Facts” that aren’t facts, “evidence” that is not evidence, “proof” that is not proof.

            And all of it obscured by mind numbing verbosity. And all of it to avoid simply facing up to the powerful testimony of Uri Avnery:

            I asked myself: what would I have done if I had been a youngster of 15 in the Gaza Strip? My answer was, without hesitation: I would have stood near the border fence and demonstrated, risking my life and limbs every minute. How am I so sure? Simple: I did the same when I was 15. I was a member of the National Military Organization (the “Irgun”), an armed underground group labeled “terrorist”.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Um, I literally quote him and explain in detail why he’s wrong. Over and over again. Why are you lying ? point to anything I said which isn’t a fact. Go ahead.
            “obscured by mind numbing verbosity” – how does quoting him and explaining why he is out of his mind “obscured by mind numbing verbosity” ? do explain.
            “avoid simply facing up to the powerful testimony of Uri Avnery” – If he’s comparing ‘Irgun’ to the likes of Hamas then he’s more demented than I thought.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            The Irgun and Lehi were terrorist organizations. The IDF today is arguably a terrorist organization too, it’s just that because of current power relationships, as opposed to those obtaining in Irgun/Lehi days, it can today disdain asymmetric methods.

            Israel Is the Terrorist
            Young Palestinians are not carrying out acts of terror- they are leading a desperate struggle against an army that is a thousand times stronger than they
            https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-israel-is-the-terrorist-1.5976966

            As with so much else, there are basic things you don’t understand and refuse to understand. It’s ok. We know you. We factor that in.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Ben, Palestinians who use violence to end the “occupation” (meaning Israel) are terrorists because they are fighting to deny another people, the Jews, the right to self-determination while struggling to create yet another Arab state that denies basic human rights and equality to non-Muslims and women, and rejects freedom of expression and religion. Hamas is a terrorist organization not just because it systematically targets civilians, but because its goals are to destroy Israel and create in its place a caliphate run in accordance with Islamic law.
            Irgun and Lehi were among the three defense force organizations that operated during the British Mandate to promote the establishment of the State of Israel as promised by the British who controlled the region, they fought the Arab murderers as well.
            Jews who fought against the British Mandate were seeking to create a democratic national homeland for Jews in their historic homeland (Which already had presence of Jews, and as promised by the British) that would incorporate a large Arab minority, alongside a Palestinian state (Israel accepted the Partition Plan).
            On occasion, organizations such as the Irgun or the Stern Group committed acts of terrorism against Palestinian civilians but those were desperate times: European Jews was being slaughtered and the British prevented European Jews to escape by blocking entry to Palestine, not to mention they fought the Arab murderers (see link in the Facebook comments section about the Anti-Jewish Arab violence in pre-state Palestine).
            Even then, their terrorist tactics were strongly criticized by the majority of Jews living in Palestine, while with the Palestinians it’s the polar opposite. Hamas, a Jihadist terrorist organizations who openly and very clearly calls for the elimination of Israel and the murder of all Jews lead half the Palestinians while the other half is ruled by Fatah who also call for the elimination of Israel and the cleansing of a future “Palestine” (all of Israel as they openly claim) from Jews.

            How many times have I told you that linking to articles behind a paywall, never mind that they are from a pro-Palestinian site that sometimes borders on science fiction from an alternate reality, is idiotic ? 7 ? 8 ? and you still do. Amazing.
            “We know you” – that’s hysterical. Here’s a link to an article with the comments section where I expose your lies, embarrassing ignorance and undeniable proof that you have no idea what you’re talking about:
            https://972mag.com/how-gazas-return-march-can-elevate-the-one-state-movement/135870/

            There are a few others but that one is the most recent. Are you going to tell the good readers to ignore the huge amount of proof that you’re a clueless liar who has no idea about what he’s talking about, like you did in the comments on that article ? it still makes me laugh, that was pathetic.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            No one here thought you would agree. It’s not the point. It’s ok. We know you. We factor that in.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            There is no ‘agree’ here, there are facts backed by evidence that you repeatedly ignore. Maybe you think by doing so they’ll go away. The ‘you don’t agree’ bit is almost as pathetic as you changing the subject and asking “the readers” to ignore the huge pile of posts showing how you are a clueless liar who has no idea what he’s talking about in the comments section here:
            https://972mag.com/how-gazas-return-march-can-elevate-the-one-state-movement/135870/

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            Translation: “How dare you, Ben, disagree about my interpretations and my propaganda, they have to be inarguable “facts,” facts! facts! facts! Say it! Say it! Say it! Waaaauuugh! I’m going to go home and cry to mommie!
            Kind of reminds me of the settler bully-children who beat up on defenseless Palestinians and then go hide behind Mama-IDF’s skirts. The difference here is that I can defend myself. It’s so unfair! LoL.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Why are you lying again ? how does facts backed by evidence is “propaganda” ? how does reality becomes “interpretations” ?
            I ask again: point to any fact I posted and prove me wrong, just like I did with your clueless nonsense. Why is this so difficult for you ?
            How can you be this delusional when the evidence is shoved in your face over and over again ? you think ignoring it will make it go away ? are you a child ?
            The cognitive dissonance of knowing that I’m right, as evident by the huge pile of posts where I prove in detail how you’re a clueless liar ho has no idea what he’s talking about, contradicting with your pathetic clinging to your delusional nonsense which has no relation to reality, must be very uncomfortable. You have my sympathies.

            “Kind of reminds me of the settler bully-children who beat up on defenseless Palestinians” – you think changing the subject again will somehow make all the evidence I posted, showing in detail how clueless you are, vanish ? you tried that before, it didn’t exactly go as you planned as I rcall.
            Well, at least you’re not going for something more pathetic like asking “the people” to ignore the countless posts where I prove in detail how you’re a clueless liar who doesn’t seem to be aware of basic facts regarding the people he’s defending. Remember that ? that was hilarious. I posted the link to that article in my post above.
            “The difference here is that I can defend myself” – I always adore it when you finish with a hearty joke. Than why don’t you ? point to any fact or evidence I posted and refute it. Go ahead. Address the posts where I show in great detail how you have no idea what you’re talking about, how the people you’re defending literally contradict you themselves, how you lie over and over again.
            go on. Why is this so difficult for you ?

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            Thanks so much for your concern but I’m in no pain, no discomfort, no dissonance, and no difficulty. It mildly disconcerts me that you adore me but I can cope nicely.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Not even a single attempt to challenge what I posted or address the facts I’m repeating showing how you’re a clueless liar who has no idea what he’s talking about. I’ll add that I also admire your commitment to denial of reality, especially when the people you’re defending literally contradict you themselves as I showed over and over again. You ignored it, but that’s a given by now.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            “Not even a single attempt to challenge what I posted or address the facts”

            Patently false. I don’t owe you this explanation and it’s way more than you deserve, but the thing is, we know you by now, and how every attempt to challenge is just an opportunity to shovel propaganda talking points, half-truths, quarter-truths and 128th-truths, and events manipulatively isolated from context and presented as “how can you deny this?,” all dressed as inarguable and compleat and suffcient “facts,” with machine like monotony. Requiring tedious refutations met only by more propaganda dressed as “so I guess that video of…is not real….” And knowing you comes with a cost, a price. For you. Reputations are earned and nothing is easier than to destroy one’s own reputation and nothing is harder than to gain it back.

            “I’m repeating…”

            Yup.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            And once more, not even a single attempt to challenge what I posted or address the facts I’m repeating showing how you’re a clueless liar who has no idea what he’s talking about.
            Saying “no it isn’t!” is acceptable if you’re 5 years old. I’m assuming you’re older.
            “I don’t owe you this explanation” – of course you do. When you make a statement you back it up. When I proved you’re a clueless liar I backed it up, when I proved you have no idea what you were talking about I backed it up by proof.
            I literally linked the people you’re defending contradicting you to your face. You repeatedly ignored this. Apparently you think this will make all of it go away. Very mature of you.
            “we know you by now” – we sure know you’re a clueless liar who doesn’t seem to know the basic facts about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict as I proved in great detail over and over again. We know you can’t back up your claims, we know you repeatedly ignore evidence not to your liking. We know you’re a liar.
            “opportunity to shovel propaganda” – evidence backed facts, including literally videos and articles of the people you claimed didn’t do something actually doing it, or claiming something you insist they never did, is not propaganda. It’s reality. And you seem to have a very hard time accepting this even when the evidence is handed to you.
            “and events manipulatively isolated from context” – by all means, show me. Prove it. Back up your nonsense. Why is this so difficult for you ?
            “presented as ‘how can you deny this?,’ all dressed as inarguable and compleat and sufficient ‘facts'”: why are you lying about this again ? I was asking why are you denying facts when the people you’re defending are literally saying what I claimed they do to your face, this is amazing to me, this is you denying the sun is hot by saying “no it isn’t!” while it burns your face. Amazing.
            “Requiring tedious refutations” – yes, it’s preposterous to ask you to back up your claims by proof, like I do.
            “propaganda dressed as “so I guess that video of…is not real….” – seriously ? lying about this as well ? I literally posted videos of Hamas/PLO leaders and their spokespersons spelling out to you how wrong you are, when you ignored it I asked you if those videos are fake or the people in them are actors pretending to be Hamas/PLO. You never answered for some reason and now you spin this lie ? remarkable.
            “Reputations are earned” – oh they sure are. You earned your clueless ‘Useful idiot’ liar badge with honor as I proved in detail over and over again.
            “I’m repeating… Yup.” – and this has nothing to do with you repeatedly ignoring the facts I’m posting backed by evidence, nothing to do with you refusing repeatedly to back up your claims, nothing at all to do with you repeatedly lying as I proved in detail in the link above from the previous article. Nothing at all, right ?

            Reply to Comment
    3. Hello

      If every shot is authorized and it is known where every bullet goes, then two other things must also be true: 1) the journalists were shot with authorization 2) the thousands of other people were shot with authorization. These in turn mean 3) there were enough officers in enough locatons to give authorization to each of the riflemen for each of the thousands of shots fired, and 4) their decisions to give authorization were made as rapidly as the thousands of shots were fired. The rifleman said to the officer I think I’ve got one I should shoot, then the officer looked into the scope of the rifle and said ok shoot that guy, then the rifleman looked back into he scope, and the guy hadn’t moved during this time, and the rifleman shot that guy that they agreed on. Or the rifleman told the officer I have in my sights a worthy target, may I shoot him, and the officer looked through binoculars and asked which guy, and the rifleman described the unique and distinctive appearance of that guy among the crowd, and the officer said oh THAT guy, yeah shoot him. These are entirely logical and plausible ways for it to have been conducted. The High Court sustained that everything was done properly. It was all carried out with precision and in accordance with the laws of the State.

      Reply to Comment
    4. Itshak Gordin Halevy

      The Palestinian Authority said yesterday that the events in Gaza were fomented and paid for by Iran. Israel was therefore absolutely right to defend itself.

      Reply to Comment
      • Ben

        Leave it to Halevy to carry Bibi’s Iran propaganda line to its reductio ad absurdum. Next thing, Halevy will announce that the libraries and swimming pools in comfy settler neighborhoods in Ariel and Ma’aleh Adumim are absolutely necesssary, necessary I tell you, as secret underground and submarine anti-Iranian-missile battery installations to defend poor, plucky little poorly armed Israel hanging on by its teeth. Poor little Israel, defending itself against women with placards and female medics. Gotta watch those female medics. Shoot on first sight, no questions asked. Yessirree, female medics are an “existential threat.” But don’t worry, the Israeli sniper checked it out with his commander because “every bullet” is scrupulously accounted for and a committee of international war crime experts deliberates before every bullet is fired! Yessirree!

        Reply to Comment
        • Ido

          Apparently violent riots including gunfire, firebombs, Molotov Cocktails, mortar fire, fire kites and attempts to breach the border is “women with placards and female medics”.
          Contrary to what that guy said, Israel’s response has nothing to do with who is funding the violent riots, it has to do with the violent riots and attempts to breach the border into Israel.
          Hamas also sent women and children purposefully to the riots area near the border, apparently turning them into propaganda material has more value to Hamas than the lives of their women and children.

          Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            I stopped reading after the propaganda term “riot,” though my eye also caught the propaganda term “Hamas sent…” somewhere too. Uri Avnery was there and testifies to something quite different from the “lies spread by the huge Israeli propaganda apparatus.” You are testimony to the apparatus.
            Avnery, however, is an excellent human being with integrity, honesty, maturity and a basic ability to empathize. And an instinctive aversion to, as opposed to a relish for, the deceits and distortions of propaganda. And not everyone has those qualities. No one thinks you will agree. It’s ok.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            So apparently violent riots including gunfire, firebombs, Molotov Cocktails, mortar fire, fire kites and attempts to breach the border, all well documented, are “peaceful civil unarmed protests”. Why are you lying about this when the evidence is shoved in your face over and over again ? lying about this won’t make the riots not exist.
            The Palestinians admit the riots are funded by Hamas who literally pay the rioters to get hurt, they admit Hamas sent women and children to the border, see the proof in the Facebook comments section. I’m assuming you’re just clueless again and not aware of these facts.
            You think this is out of character for Hamas ? are you that clueless ? the terrorists who perfected the use of their own civilians as human shields for propaganda material ?
            Stop reading if you like, reality isn’t going to change.

            Avnery, as I proved in detail the post above, is the epitome of the ‘Useful Idiot’. I do believe he means well but he says lie after lie, doesn’t seem to know who are the people he is talking to, not aware of some of the basic facts about Hamas and Fatah which they admit themselves. I have no doubt the Islamic Jihadist terrorists adore him. He’s a valuable asset for propaganda material.

            By all means, point to any of the facts I mentioned about this “excellent human being” lies and cluelessness in the post above and prove me wrong. Go ahead.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            Didn’t think you’d agree. Or that you’d drop off anything but the same large jumbled pile of deceit, distortions, distractions, and the ever present slander. Like a dump truck. Plop. It’s not my job to shovel through it. Thanks again.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            I repeat: explain how violent riots including gunfire, firebombs, Molotov Cocktails, mortar fire, fire kites and attempts to breach the border, all well documented, are “peaceful civil unarmed protests”.
            I have no idea why you keep lying about this but it’s still amusing. Why are you ignoring the pile of evidence I posted in the Facebook comments section ? proving everything I said ?
            Nice diversion attempt with the ‘you don’t agree’ bit, irrelevant and pathetic but amusing. Like you attempted to change the subject in the comments here:
            https://972mag.com/how-gazas-return-march-can-elevate-the-one-state-movement/135870/

            somehow thinking this will avert attention from the fact that I proved you’re a clueless liar who has no idea what he’s talking about. In detail.
            That’s the beauty of facts, you can deny them as much as you like, it won’t make them go away. Or actually are you going to address them this time and refute them ? go ahead. Why is this so difficult for you ?

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            “I repeat”

            You certainly do.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            hard not to notice how you ignored it again. Probably an honest mistake so I’ll ask again:
            explain how violent riots including gunfire, firebombs, Molotov Cocktails, mortar fire, fire kites and attempts to breach the border, all well documented, are “peaceful civil unarmed protests”.

            Why is this so difficult for you ?
            Why are you ignoring the evidence I posted in the Facebook comments section again ? proving everything I said ? why are you ignoring the evidence I posted in the link in my previous post ?

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            Don’t worry, ignoring fake, manipulative propaganda “questions” is quite easy for me. Nothing about it is difficult.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Hilarious, you can’t touch it with a ten foot pole. Calling the huge amount of posts ( linked 4 posts above) and the evidence backing them up, showing in great detail how you’re a clueless liar who doesn’t seem to know basic info about the people you’re defending “fake, manipulative propaganda” will not somehow make it go away no matter how hard you try.
            Reality, no matter how uncomfortable for you, remains the same.
            Very mature of you to try and avoid simple questions that you can’t seem to answer for I lost count how many times, demonstrating your lost touch with reality. Why is it so hard to answer such a simple question ?
            How violent riots including gunfire, firebombs, Molotov Cocktails, mortar fire, fire kites and attempts to breach the border, all well documented, are “peaceful civil unarmed protests” ? why is answering this question is so difficult for you ?

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            Here’s a reality, a law of internet reality:

            An internet troll’s effectiveness declines according to the parabolic function

            f(x) = a • x squared

            with a = -2.

            and x = time spent getting to know the troll (troll exposure time)

            It’s a steep fall.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Amazing, you still can’t touch it with a ten foot pole.
            You are yet to explain how a huge amount of posts (in the comments section in the article linked 6 posts above) and the evidence backing them up, which you are again desperately trying to ignore, showing in great detail how you’re a clueless liar who obviously has no idea what he’s talking about is “fake, manipulative propaganda”.
            Again going with the name-calling as if this will somehow cancel out all the posts and evidence (which you have yet to even acknowledge exist even though they are right there, in the Facebook comments section on that article I linked) I provided.
            Again attempting to avoid the uncomfortable reality, including evidence of the people you’re defending literally shouting in your face what I claimed they say, they themselves are telling you you’re wrong but you’re still in denial, thinking calling me a troll will somehow make it all go away.
            Why is this question so hard for you to answer ? you made a stupid comment about the Gaza protests. I pointed it out and provided proof refuting your clueless nonsense which you of course ignored so I sum it up in a simple question:
            How violent riots including gunfire, firebombs, Molotov Cocktails, mortar fire, fire kites and attempts to breach the border, all well documented, are “peaceful civil unarmed protests” ? why is answering this question is so difficult for you ?

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            You’re a textbook case and are the last person in the room to see yourself as you really are. As internet trolls will do, you are posing a calculatedly simplistic and manipulative question as a sufficient one, as based on an accurate and not misleading description. It is not. It does not for one thing account for how the protests started out peacefully and the Israeli military snipers coldly, calmly assassinated protestors and protest “instigators” and very deliberately made every attempt to convert the protest to violence. Standard Israeli operating procedure. In the West Bank they use mistaravim to speed the process along and then shoot people after they’ve egged them on with undercover agents. The other side is not perfect but the Israeli apparatus will stoop to anything to exploit vulnerabilities and make things violent, because they fear nonviolence most of all. It does not account for the vast majority who were peaceful and shot anyway (using particularly vicious and illegal and completely unnecessary ammunition and shooting practices even if we bought the Israeli line which we don’t—see Avihai Stollar’s article today). It does not account for this:
            https://972mag.com/how-the-idf-is-tarnishing-the-name-of-the-medic-it-killed-in-gaza/136046/
            Now as internet trolls will do, you will take my succinct dissection of your tactics here and see your foot in the door and delightedly respond with endless verbose screeds about Hamas organizing and Hamas ‘Jew killing’ and Hamas this and that and look what “they” say and I guess you didn’t see this video and you are a clueless lying liar who lies and I provided huuuuuuuge (lol) mountains of “evidence” and “proved” it and linked to it even and you won’t touch it with a fifty zillion foot pole blah blah blah. (One of the peculiar delusions of internet trolls is their belief that anyone goes back and looks at never mind wades through their tedious “works.”) The thing we don’t want to touch even with a pole is the troll. Ain’t no pole long enough. Trolls love it and it only eggs them on.
            And the key thing: every response, including this bone I am throwing you here, is only used by an internet troll to toss more propaganda. Key point. The key point.
            And I’m not playing your game.
            The problem you have is that we know you.
            You are at the tail end of y = a•x squared. How does it feel?
            Look way up there on the top of this page. The subject is “IDF refuses to say what it’s doing to avoid killing more journalists.” You’ve done your troll best to distract from that. We’re not playing your game though you’ll continue to try, we guarantee it. Bye bye troll.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            (part 1): Ben, there are literally dozen of posts, including the many in the comments in the link I provided a few posts above which you so desperately ignore, showing in great detail how you have no idea what you’re talking about, how you lie repeatedly, how you’re embarrassingly clueless
            to the point of contradicting the jihadist terrorist anti-semitic murderers who they themselves provided evidence proving I’m right and you are very, very wrong. You again and again ignore the evidence I provide including actual videos of Palestinian leaders and their spokespersons contradicting your nonsense (see the Facebook comments section in the link I provided 8 posts ago) as if doing so will make it go away, you again and again ignore what
            seem to be very uncomfortable questions for you, illustrating your idiotic nonsense by having you confront it. Calling me names will not make the huge amount of proof, showing very, very clearly that you are a clueless liar.
            I’ll link other articles with comments sections also proving in great detail how you are a ‘Useful Idiot’ who doesn’t seem to know basic facts about Israel or the Palestinians, hopefully it won’t take days for this site to post them.
            “calculatedly simplistic and manipulative question as a sufficient one” – total nonsense. This question is making you confront some of the more idiotic thing you said about the Gaza protests, forcing you to realize that what you said about the violent riots was embarrassingly foolish.
            I repeat: How violent riots including gunfire, firebombs, Molotov Cocktails, mortar fire, fire kites and attempts to breach the border, all well documented, are “peaceful civil unarmed protests” ?
            “It is not.” – I was quoting you and one of the articles we discussed. So it wasn’t you ?
            “It does not for one thing account for how the protests started out peacefully and the Israeli military snipers coldly, calmly assassinated protestors” – idiotic lie. Yow can you say that with a straight face when there is so much evidence (which I provided, and you ignored) contradicting it ?
            Even Hamas themselves admit almost all the dead were their terrorists, would you like me to provide the proof again ? you’re not going to ignore it this time ? how can you ignore the violent riots at the border ? which included guns (Hamas is on record telling people to come armed on social media), firebombs, Molotov cocktails, slingshots, attempts of armed terrorist units to cross the border, mortar fire, etc.
            Israel fired on them, the ones at the border riots, not at the actual peaceful protesters. Why do you continue to lie about this when the evidence is shoved in your face over and over again ?
            “and protest “instigators” and very deliberately made every attempt to convert the protest to violence. Standard Israeli operating procedure” – another idiotic lie. Hamas organized the riots deliberately, there is evidence of them paying for people to riot and get hurt for propaganda reason (I provided the evidence, you lied and ignored it), they are on record admitting most of the dead rioters were their terrorists, the entire point of the riots were to have thousands of Palestinians breach the border and cross it into Israel for a great photo-op.
            Hamas failed.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            (part 2) Ben: “mistaravim to speed the process along and then shoot people after they’ve egged them on with undercover agents” – right, those Palestinian rioters want to kill Jews and destroy Israel because of mistaravim units. So all the incidents where no mistaravim were present, including the Gaza border riots, they used mind control technique on the rioters ?
            “The other side is not perfect” – that’s an interesting phrase to describe anti-semitic murderers who refuse to accept the legitimate existence of Israel and call for the murder of Jews, who say so openly as I proved to you over and over again which you of course ignored.
            “Israeli apparatus will stoop to anything to exploit vulnerabilities and make things violent” – how can you say something that stupid ? you’re blaming Israel for ‘exploit vulnerabilities’ that you claim cause the Palestinian violence ? are you crazy ? do you have no idea what is going on ? nothing at all about Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Fatah etc and their goals and actions ? this is so detached from reality, goes beyond ‘Useful Idiot’ into brain damage.
            “It does not account for the vast majority who were peaceful and shot anyway” – vast majority ? so now you’re inventing stuff. The ones protesting away from the border riots were not harmed.
            “using particularly vicious and illegal and completely unnecessary ammunition” – allow me to quote Ha’aretz, a favorite of yours: It’s clear, then, that Israel could not have sat idly by until the fence was breached. What is there, then, between passivity, on one hand, and the use of live ammunition, on the other? What remains are water cannons, tear gas and rubber bullets – there are no other magical options. Alas, none of these would have been useful under the circumstances. Rubber bullets are effective only within a range of between 30 and 50 meters. If used at closer range, they are deadly and much less accurate than live fire; they may hit other people in the target’s vicinity. More than 50 meters away, they are useless. Water cannons have the same approximate range. This means that both are effective only at a distance where IDF snipers would have been exposed to the weapons wielded by the rioters, who outnumbered them: Molotov cocktails, grenades, pistols, slingshots and rocks. What remains is tear gas, but it has very little effect in open-air settings, and in any case cannot stop a stampeding crowd.
            So live sniper fire is the only means that is effective.
            “It does not account for this” – yes, Hamas using women and children as human shields (as I proved to you, with detailed evidence, which you of course ignored) is despicable.
            “endless verbose screeds” – interesting interpretation to post after post of me proving in detail how you’re a clueless liar who has no idea what he’s talking about. Calling it “screeds” will not somehow make it all go away, just like calling me a troll won’t make it go away, just like repeatedly ignoring it or lying about it. It’s amusing though.
            “Hamas organizing and Hamas ‘Jew killing’ and Hamas this and that” – proved this to you in detail in the Facebook comments section in the link 8 posts above. You seem to be in denial of the fact that Hamas are a Jihadist terrorist organization who openly calls for the elimination of Israel and the murder of Jews, they preach it in the Gaza mosques, they teach this to children in Gaza children shows.
            The evidence is right there, you ignored it. Repeatedly.
            “I guess you didn’t see this video” – I posted videos of the Palestinian leadership, both from Hamas and Fatah, literally contradicting your nonsense, literally saying to your face that they don’t accept the legitimacy of Israel’s existence, that they call for the murder of Jews, that they see future “Palestine” as Jew-Free, etc. Everything I said I backed by proof, you ignored it. Why is that ? why is it so difficult for you to accept reality ?

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            (Part 3): “you are a clueless lying liar” – I literally provided a list in the comments section on the article I linked a few posts above. Quoting you lying. I don’t get it, how can you say something this stupid when the list is right there ? you think lying about this will somehow make it go away ?
            “mountains of “evidence” and “proved” it and linked to it even and you won’t touch it with a fifty zillion foot pole blah blah blah” – why are you lying about this again ? why are you lying that I posted evidence over and over again ? which you haven’t addressed, I’m assuming because doing so will make you come to the accept the fact that you have no idea what you’re talking about.
            “One of the peculiar delusions of internet trolls is their belief that anyone goes back and looks at never mind wades through their tedious “works” – one of the more peculiar delusions of the ‘Useful Idiot’ is to ignore detailed evidence showing him how wrong he is.
            “The thing we don’t want to touch even with a pole is the troll”- that question really bothered you, didn’t it ? you were wrong. Deal with it. How many times you ignored it ? I really lost count.
            “to toss more propaganda” – you really seem to think calling posts detailing your ignorance and lies, backed by evidence, propaganda will somehow make it all go away. This is literally infantile.
            “You’ve done your troll best to distract from that” – aaaand another lie. No I didn’t, I responded directly to your delusional nonsense. When you lied about the Palestinians riots and I quote you: “They did not draw weapons”, “They did not storm the fence”, “They stood exposed to the sharpshooters and were killed”, all refuted by me repeatedly with evidence you ignored, see the links at the beginning of the comments section.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            Oh hey, it’s you again, what a surprise. I stand by what I said and do not see that your perseverative ad hominem attacks should modify my recent, in depth statement: “Bye bye troll.”

            But now that I have you here, I was just reading an excellent piece by your countryman Larry Derfner. I thought you’d be interested since it dismantles every claim you and other tireless propagandists have made about the recent reality in Gaza.

            Israel’s Propaganda Can’t Hide the Harsh Reality of 123-0 Gaza Killing Count
            Larry DerfnerJune 11, 2018
            Read more: https://forward.com/opinion/402888/israels-propaganda-war-cant-hide-the-harsh-reality-of-123-0-gaza-killing/

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            “I stand by what I said” = “let’s ignore all the amount of posts explaining how I’m wrong, let’s ignore the links showing how I have no idea what I’m talking about, let’s ignore the list of lies, etc, I refuse to accept reality and substitute it with my own and that’s good enough for me!”
            I actually laughed for quite some time, thanks!
            “your perseverative ad hominem attacks” – how do you translate the amount of posts showing in detail how you’re a clueless liar who is a textbook example of ‘Useful Idiot’, who refuses to accept the uncomfortable facts even when the terrorists you’re defending literally yell it in your face, to “ad hominem attacks” ?
            I literally addressed everything you said. Everything I said I backed with proof. You’re the one who is calling me a troll, thinking this somehow will cancel out all the evidence I provide. You’re hilarious.
            “But now that I have you here, I was just reading an excellent piece by your countryman” – changing the subject again ? why not just ask “the folks” to ignore the huge amount of posts showing in detail how you’re a clueless liar ? you did it before, it’s almost as amusing.
            “since it dismantles every claim you and other tireless propagandists have made about the recent reality in Gaza” – Nope, no it doesn’t. I always like it when you finish with a hearty joke. Hamas themselves contradict his nonsense.
            Some of his lies: ” Are most of the protesters really Hamasniks” – that’s not what was said, it was said that most of the people who were shot were members of Hamas, as admitted by Hamas.
            “The hasbara line is that this is purely a Hamas production: Hamas is “pushing” Gazan civilians to the front to risk their lives” – Hamas is on record doing so, in social media, with payment incentives, literally asking the protesters to violently breach the border.
            “They’re putting themselves in mortal danger simply by showing up” – lie. Those who didn’t riot or were near the borders were not harmed, tens of thousands of them.
            “it’s a calculated act by Hamas to try to kill Jews and destroy the Jewish state” – Hamas, literally their leaders, are on record saying exactly that. This is their openly stated goal. The guy lives under a rock ?
            “So which is it? Are most of the protesters really Hamasniks” – no one said that , he’s lying.
            “God forbid, break through it into Israeli territory must be shot because if he gets through, he’s liable to kill or kidnap soldiers” – oh yes, those armed Hamas/Islamic Jihad units hiding among the protesters were only coming to deliver flowers. If he thinks Israel should have allowed the rioters to breach the border he’s crazy.
            “In fact, numerous Gazans have gotten through the fence into Israel since the protests began, and they’ve done zero harm to Israeli life or property” – could be because they were immediately caught ?

            He’s ignoring Hamas sent women and children to be human shields, as I proved to you before (which you ignored of course), He’s ignoring Hamas paying protesters, telling them to bring weapons, the violent riots at the border, how the majority of protesters, who didn’t riot at the border were not hurt, etc.
            He’s completely ignoring what the Hamas leader in Gaza himself said about the goals of the “Return March”: The plan was “to take down the border and tear out their (Israelis) hearts from their bodies” (quote from Sinwar himself).
            For example: The number of people killed on the day the U.S. Embassy was moved to Jerusalem, was 61 (62 including the lie of a dead baby killed by Israel, later even Hamas admitted it was a lie). According to Haaretz, about 2,770 were wounded, of these an estimated 1,350 from live ammunition. This means that 95 percent of those hit by snipers were neutralized without being killed, despite the smoke, noise and pandemonium.
            Of the 61 killed, about 50, according to Hamas themselves, were members of that organization (which is not to say that there were no members of other military organizations among the remaining 11).
            At the end he seems to be lamenting the fact that no Israeli soldiers were hurt or killed, as if the number of casualties on the Israeli side is relevant or indicating morality. It’s always amusing to me to read this biased liars who seem to be distressed that there not enough dead Jews.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Links to articles with comments sections and proof at the Facebook comments, showing in detail how you are a clueless liar who has no idea what he’s talking about:

            This one also has a detailed list of your lies:
            https://972mag.com/how-gazas-return-march-can-elevate-the-one-state-movement/135870/

            Another with a detailed list of your lies and errors:
            https://972mag.com/palestinian-poet-convicted-of-inciting-terror-in-facebook-poem/135087/

            Some more:
            https://972mag.com/youre-far-more-likely-to-be-killed-protesting-in-gaza-than-firing-a-rocket/134952/
            https://972mag.com/thousands-of-israelis-palestinians-mark-memorial-day-together/134779/

            I can go on but that’s more than enough evidence for even a lobotomized brick.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            I fail to understand why you make it so easy to make fun of you. It’s a mystery.

            Geller: “….clueless liar who is a textbook example of ‘Useful Idiot’…you’re a clueless liar…biased liars…clueless liar…lobotomized brick.”

            Geller: ‘“ad hominem attacks” ?’

            So…I’ll leave it to others to judge your abilities; and maturity level.

            Now, let’s see, scanning the rest…hmmm, no, no, we opine that we see multiple examples falling on a spectrum of distortions to brazen prevarications and think the account and analysis of Larry Derfner’s is far more plausible on the face of it and has far more of a ring of truth to it, is the more truthful by a large margin, and is much better analyzed and argued. This is our judgment.

            I’ll be seeing ya.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            I fail to understand how you can ignore the huge amount of posts above showing in great detail how you’re a clueless liar who has no idea what he’s talking about, a classic ‘Useful Idiot’. This is truly a mystery.
            And you lie about this as well which is truly amazing. I never called you a lobotomized brick, I said there’s enough evidence for even a lobotomized brick which I’m sure you aren’t, I called you a clueless liar and provided enough evidence for it to fill a book including two lists of your lies, literally quoting you lying (see first the comments sections of the first 2 links),
            I called you a ‘Useful Idiot’ (a propagandist for a cause and goals of which you are not fully aware of) because that’s exactly what you are and I provided a huge amount of proof for it, which you repeatedly ignored again of course.
            Why are you changing the subject again ? you think this will somehow make all the evidence I posted above disappear ?
            “multiple examples falling on a spectrum of distortions” – again, where ? which ones ? prove it. Everything I said was backed by evidence and proof. Why is this so difficult for you ?
            “analysis of Larry Derfner’s is far more plausible” – the guy is a liar, I literally pointed out where in detail. You choose to ignore it ? well, what a shock. Not going to change the fact that he’s a liar, like you.
            “This is our judgment.” – and again you deny reality and substitute it with your own. Again you ignore the evidence I provided because addressing it will make you face the uncomfortable truth.

            “I’ll be seeing ya” – oh you can count on that. A clueless liar ‘Useful Idiot’ like you is an endless source of amusement.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            You’ll be seeing me like Wiley E. Coyote seeing the backside of Roadrunner. Beep beep!

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Let’s see how many times you’re going to ignore the huge amount of posts, comments and evidence showing in great detail how you’re a clueless liar who has no idea what he’s talking about.
            And apparently you don’t know what ‘ad hominem’ means. I didn’t avoid your posts and attacked you, I did exactly the opposite: I proved in great detail how what you’re saying is delusional nonsense mixed with obvious lies.
            You’re the one who called me a troll without backing up your nonsense or even addressing the facts and evidence in my posts, repeatedly.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            “clueless liar” (multiple times in multiple copies over multiple days) and “lobotomized brick” are ad hominems.

            Beep beep!

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Do you think behaving like a child is endearing ? I don’t get it. The lists detailing your lies are 6 posts above. Same with the posts showing in detail how you’re a clueless liar ‘Useful Idiot’. You know, what you just ignored. Again.
            “Beep beep!” – hilarious, the only thing you seem to be running from is acknowledging reality. Again.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            I’m switching cartoons. You have an Elmer Fudd “I’m chasing wabbits!” quality about you.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            The lists detailing your lies, cluelessness and delusional nonsense are 8 posts above. Same with the posts showing in detail how you’re a clueless liar ‘Useful Idiot’ backed by evidence you repeatedly ignored. Just like now.
            let’s see how deep your denial goes. I think we’re going for a record.

            Reply to Comment
          • Ben

            “8 posts above”

            Shhhhhhhh! Be vewy vewy quiet! He’s hunting wabbits!

            Reply to Comment
          • Ido

            Yes, this definitely will make all the linked posts above filled with evidence how you’re a clueless liar who has no idea what he’s talking about disappear. Keep trying though.

            Reply to Comment
    5. Ida Kolls

      my advice for how to avoid murdering journalists, paramedics, Palestinian children with sniper bullets is stop the IDF shoot to kill orders and don’t issue any live ammunitions

      Reply to Comment
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