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Weekly Notebook: On Bibi's lies, BDS, reality shows, and more

New feature: A selection of Larry Derfner’s sociopolitical outbursts on Facebook (and one email) for the week ending Saturday, April 5. 

Illustrative photo by Shutterstock.com

Illustrative photo by Shutterstock.com

 

WHAT HAVE THEY DONE FOR US LATELY?
FB reaction to commenter who asks, “What have the Palestinians done to advance peace recently?” (Sunday, March 30):

Close, daily security cooperation with the IDF and Shin Bet for 10 full years. They’ve arrested thousands of Hamasniks. It’s a key reason why terror is so low, and the only reason why you don’t see massive anti-Israeli demonstrations. Palestinian forces are policing the Palestinian population areas – the cities, the villages, the refugee camps – not the IDF. As Dov Weisglas once said, the West Bank is the world’s only prison where the prisoners guard themselves.

This is why Israel does not want the PA to fold, why it dreads the prospect of it, and why Abbas keeps threatening it. When I say “Israel” I mean the army and the government – the Israeli public has no responsibility, it doesn’t need to keep this information in mind, so it doesn’t, which allows people to ask “what have the Palestinians done to advance peace recently?”


 

EXPOSING DERSHOWITZ:
On his Haaretz op-ed, “J Street’s hypocrisy must be exposed.” (FB, Friday, March 28):

Alan Dershowitz goes after J Street as being dangerously left-wing, calls the Goldstone Report “mendacious and despicable” (he called its author an “evil, evil man”) while describing himself for the zillionth time as a supporter of the two-state solution. Dershowitz is the ultimate new Zionist “centrist” – a bloodthirsty warmonger who cheers home every Israeli bullet aimed at any Arab, but says with a smile that he wants peace. He’s reminiscent of Nixon at his most lethal. This is the sort of person who gets raised up as a Zionist hero for our time.


 

ISRAELIS ABROAD:
On Haaretz op-ed “Why Israelis make the worst tourists,”  about how South American Jews are tired of apologizing for the often offensive, destructive behavior of ubiquitous Israeli backpackers. (FB, Monday, March 31):

This is written by an “active member of the Jewish community” in Santiago, Chile. She’s describing Israeli post-army trekkers – but it holds true for the pre-army trekkers, too, who may be even worse. I think army behavior (the experience or anticipation of it) is part of the reason, but not the main one – the main one is the radical inconsiderateness that’s acceptable behavior in this country – even if most Israelis don’t like it, they won’t stop it. And when you get young Israelis traveling in groups abroad, especially in countries many of them think of as “primitive,” it’s not going to be pretty.

Why is obnoxiousness such a common quality among Israelis? Take people with a harsh background, give them a country with a harsh climate and landscape to settle, and a harsh reaction from the “natives,” and a harsh-sounding, blunt language, and teach them that they’re the lords of the land and, last of all, give them parents who typically treat them like they’re little gods and goddesses, and what do you get? An unusually high gross national product – pun intended – of obnoxious behavior.


 

BIBI BARES HIS SOUL:
The PM goes on a comedy show to stand up for his wife (and himself) against latest claims by ex-household staff that his wife Sara is a witch and he goes along with her. (FB, March 26):

Watch the brief video of Bibi’s prime-time declaration of love for Sara. If you don’t feel embarrassed, well, I don’t know. This is the phoniest human being I’ve ever seen. Once again, he displays that special quality of his: absolute shamelessness.


 

THE BDS LONG GAME:
Response to sympathizer who is skeptical about whether BDS can force Israel to end the occupation, when the right wing and the settlers are so entrenched (Email, March 29):

I think that if it’s going to happen, it’s going to follow the S. African precedent – years of build-up of pressure until the Israeli public says enough – and at that point it won’t require a left-wing leader, just a competent, centrist manager like De Klerk to carry out the national will.

And if it happens, I’m pretty sure Israel won’t make the mistake again of forcibly throwing settlers out of their homes, which in this case could set off a civil war, but instead just take a government decision to be be out of the territory on such and such a date, and that the settlers are more than welcome to relocate inside the new border before then (in return for what I hope will be mammoth compensation), but that after that date, they’re on their own. Just like the French did it in Algeria. (Don’t know if they gave the pied noir much compensation, though.)

No more than a few nutcases would remain in the settlements, and the Palestinian cops could round them up and turn them over to Israel. At worst you’d have a Waco or two, and they wouldn’t have much sympathy from Israelis.

But like I said, I think this is going to take a good few years of softening up Israelis until they’re ready. And all kinds of other unexpected things could happen, of course. But basically, I don’t see Israel being able to go on with the occupation and getting away with it indefinitely. (I don’t see it being able to go on bombing neighboring countries and getting away with that indefinitely, either.)

I think there’s been a change in the world’s perception – it sees that the occupation is not temporary or provisional, that this is what Israel has chosen – and if the Palestinians fight back non-violently, it’s going to be very hard for the world to go on enabling Israel to keep them down.


 

IT’S NOT JUST LIBYA AND SYRIA:
On United Nations Human Rights Council’s latest votes against occupation. (FB, Saturday, March 29):

Look which countries joined the 46-1 vote in the UNHRC against Israel over the occupation (supposedly “pro-Israel” countries are capitalized): Austria, Chile, COSTA RICA, CZECH REPUBLIC, Estonia, France, GERMANY, Ireland, Italy, Japan, Mexico, Peru, Phillipines, South Korea, Romania, Russia, Macedonia, UNITED KINGDOM. Once again, only America backed Israel. Israelis and Americans think the UNHRC is run by Arab and left-wing Third World countries because no one else could be so “anti-Israel.” Well, it turns out you don’t have to be Arab, left-wing or Third World to oppose the occupation.


 

PALESTINIANS IN A CORNER:
Reactions to news of emerging U.S./Israel offer to Abbas (Palestinians agree to extend peace talks until next year, in return Israel makes good on its broken promise to free 26 long-term prisoners, plus another 400 of its choosing, and agrees to “restrain” construction in the West Bank, though not in East Jerusalem) (FB, Tuesday, April 1):

1. It’s a bad deal for the Palestinians – they have to sit still for the occupation another year in return for very little – the release of hundreds of prisoners who were due to be released soon anyway, and a reduction in the growth of settlements – not a settlement freeze nor, God forbid, a removal of settlements, nor even of illegal outposts. The problem is that I don’t know if the Palestinians can afford to turn it down – it looks to the outside world like the U.S. is bending over backwards and Israel is finally being flexible (gag); if the Palestinians were to turn down the offer and refuse to extend the peace talks, they would be widely blamed, and they would launch their international campaign with a cloud over their heads in the eyes of all but their committed supporters. Maybe they can negotiate a slightly tougher deal on settlement construction. But I think they’ve been boxed in by the fucking Americans again.

2. I think the Palestinians should demand a real settlement freeze – an absolute ban on construction over the Green Line, which is what Obama and Hillary Clinton demanded at first – and if Israel agrees, they should extend the peace talks, and if Israel balks, they should go to the UN. What Kerry is offering is not a settlement freeze, only a reduction in settlement growth, which the world will not demand that the Palestinians accept.


 

HASBARA CONSPIRACY?
Once again, an “outsider” wins Israeli reality show (FB, Saturday, April 5):

Alright all you leftist cynics out there – yes, an Arab woman won Master Chef, again an Arab, Ethiopian or foreign worker wins an Israeli reality show, so you’re thinking, “Hasbara! Conspiracy!” But anyone who watched the show could see that Nof was clearly the best, no question.


 

VILIFYING J STREET:
On a U.S. campaign hit piece put out by pro-Israel neocons (FB, Tuesday, April 1):

Joe McCarthy had nothing on William Kristol, Noah Pollak, Michael Goldfarb, Gary Bauer and the rest of the chickenhawks at the Emergency Committee for Israel. Here is ECI’s new 30-second TV campaign ad against U.S. Congressman Walter Jones, who’s in the Rand Paul “isolationist” camp of the Republican Party. At one point the film shows a crowd burning American and Israeli flags as the narrator says Jones “is endorsed by an anti-Israel” group, and the group’s logo, above the words “endorsed by anti-Israel group,” appears on the screen. Which “anti-Israel group” are they talking about? J Street. My advice to J Street: Hire private detectives and sic them on Kristol, Pollak, Goldfarb, Bauer and anybody else connected with ECI, and if you can, destroy them.             


 

ISRAEL’S BRAINWASHED MEDIA:
How the country’s most popular, influential newspaper and TV news show are covering the breakdown in the peace talks.

(FB, Friday April 4) Yedioth Ahronoth, the best window on Israel there is, takes the line today that “the Palestinians broke the rules.” Abbas’ move to sign Palestine on to 15 international conventions – that’s what caused the crisis in the peace talks, not Israel’s refusal to free 26 prisoners as promised last Friday, not the announcement of 700 new West Bank housing tenders. That’s been forgotten as if it never happened – the whole thing, according to Yedioth’s headlines, news story and lead column, started with the Palestinians and their international conventions.

A “senior Israeli official” explains Israel’s decision yesterday to cancel the fourth prisoner release: “Our goal now is to stop everything – to toughen our stance and then start over at the beginning.” The thinking in Jerusalem, the story says, is that the world “understands that the Palestinians are to blame for the crisis,” so the strategy is to take measured steps and not freak out so the blame will stay on their heads. Israeli official: “They went to the UN knowing that we’re releasing prisoners. They did it purposely – and now they have to pay the price.”

The Israeli government believes the world blames the Palestinians for the failure of the peace talks, and now the Palestinians are going to come crawling back to the negotiations. And the newspaper of the nation” pretty much tells the story from the government’s point of view. This country is so brainwashed, from top to bottom, that it’s completely lost touch with reality.

(FB, Saturday, April 5) I just watched the tape of last night’s Channel 2 news, with the discussion of the peace talks and the interview with Palestinian official Jibril Rajoub. There was only one Israeli journalist (Dana Weiss) on the panel who didn’t sound like Bibi’s spokesman; otherwise, they were all on board for blaming the Palestinians completely. The anchor (Danny Cushmaro), the “reporter” (Udi Segal) and the commentator (Ehud Ya’ari) all grilled Rajoub not like journalists, but like Likudniks. They spoke of “our” position, identifying themselves with the government. Israel’s “fiercely independent” media at work.


 

OLMERT, FINALLY:
Immediate reactions to news of ex-PM’s bribery conviction. (FB, Monday, March 31):

1. YES!!!

2. Very proud of the Israeli justice system today. Convicting an ex-PM for bribery isn’t a small thing.

3. Why are all these phonies saying this is a sad day because a former PM was convicted of bribery? Did anyone think Olmert isn’t a crook? He’s managed to beat back corruption charges since the 1980s, if not earlier, because he hires teams of great lawyers and he’s a slick lawyer himself, so he’s fairly adept at covering his tracks. This is a great day – the bastard finally got caught but good. And there is no way on earth he’s not going to prison for years. It’s just too bad that that even more talented master criminal, Avigdor Lieberman, and the thousands of other thieves in Israeli politics aren’t going in with him.


 

OBJECTIVE JOURNALISM: DISHONEST AND DANGEROUS:
In general, and specifically with regard to the Kerry peace talks (FB, Saturday, April 5):

1. I just read the New York Times‘ two latest big news stories on the peace process, or maybe one was a news story and the other an “analysis” or “background” or something, and you couldn’t find anything in either story that said which side, Israel or the Palestinians, was guilty, or just guiltier than the other side, even by a hair. The implication was that each side is exactly 50 percent guilty – and that, of course, is nonsense, and the writers and the newspaper know it’s nonsense, so it’s also dishonest. But that’s the story that objective journalism tells about every conflict – a false, dishonest one.

2. And when objective journalism portrays both sides of a conflict as being precisely 50 percent guilty, which is never, ever the case, it gives aid and comfort to the guilty, or guiltier, side, while heaping additional injustice on the side that’s innocent, or at least relatively so. And I can’t think of a better example of this than the news coverage of the Kerry peace talks, which assign moral equivalence to the conqueror and the conquered.

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  • COMMENTS

    1. BaladiAkka 1948

      That New York Times article written by Gordon and Landler is out-right lying when it states:
      “There was an acho in Mr Kerry’s tone of a frustrated outburst in 1990 by James Baker, who read out the number for the White House swithboard at a congressional hearing and told the Israelis and the Palestinians ‘When you’re serious about peace, call us’ ”

      That was only directed at the Israelis, the Palestinians weren’t mentioned at all ! as Ali Abunimah points out in this article (video of Baker’s words at the congressional hearing embedded)
      http://www.electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/ny-times-rewrites-peace-process-history-make-it-more-balanced

      Reply to Comment
    2. Philos

      Thanks Larry. With regards to BDS Long Game, you seem to be operating on the supposition that it will lead to a two-state settlement. I think this is mistaken. The ideological composition of the BDS movement is based on human rights discourse, which means civil rights for Palestinians. If BDS becomes the only game in town then the Palestinians will fight for one democratic state between the sea and the river. The idea that they would settle on a rump state based on the ’67 borders after forcing Israel to capitulate to that demand without negotiations seems far-fetched.

      Reply to Comment
      • My fear is that resistance cannot remain completely nonviolent (leaving aside stone throwing), which will allow Israel to affirm its necessary sovereignty logic. If Israel suppresses nonviolent action without allowing some victories, it will box itself into another self perceived Gaza corner–”we can’t leave because of what will emerge if we do.”

        The best hope I see is a move towards some civil victories, as Israel does need PA security and city governance. This would press for rights recognition along the lines you suggest. But there is a significant difference between SA and the WB in economically overlapping population. SA could not cordon off its controlled population; Israel has actually worked at making sure it can. Economic ties are needed to make protest bite back onto the controlling population. Asking BDS from abroad to do that is asking for a lot. It will have to get very bad from the outside looking in for that. Recall that the US Congress refused sanctions on SA until the USSR collapsed. Israel has Arab State instability to tout similarly, and I do think it would slow down any Western BDS support at a State level.

        This is why I advocated an economic confederation in small stages. Economic rights eventually morph into human and political rights, but in a more planned way. One could begin to advocate cultural autonomy of two regions with single external sovereignty, then try to decide on the character of a Confederation Assembly or such. This would require civil protest too–but with growing economic ties, the logic of conciliation would reach more minds.

        Anyway, nothing is changing now.

        Reply to Comment
        • Samuel

          ” … as Israel does need PA security and city governance.”

          And the Palestinian Arabs don’t need it?

          Reply to Comment
      • Thank you, Philos. The thing is, there’s no meaningful support for the one-state system outside the Muslim world, and Israelis (including myself) won’t go for it, certainly not right off the bat. If it were to evolve agreeably out of a two-state system (which I seriously doubt, but I’d be happy to be wrong), then fine.

        Reply to Comment
        • Philos

          True. Although with Jewish Home and strong currents of the Likud killing off the idea of a two-state solution within Israel the prospect of a single-state might seem like the only viable option to most Israelis in 10-15 years time even they’re wary of it.

          Let’s not forget that the collapse of apartheid also brought about an exodus of white South Africans either fearing the worst or unable to countenance the idea of black equality. You can find several thousand of them living in Herzeliya, Ranana and the settlements.

          Reply to Comment
        • BaladiAkka 1948

          “The thing is there is no meaningful support for the one-state system outside the Muslim world”
          Really ? Just one example out of many. This recent poll by Shibley Telhami (Palestinian born in Israel), professor at University of Maryland: If two states collapse, Americans overwhelmingly favor democracy:
          http://www.mondoweiss.net/2014/03/collapse-americans-democracy.html

          Concerning “Israelis won’t go for it” maybe one day you won’t have the choice.
          Israelis should really study the history of the French presence in Algeria: from the beginning of the ‘nationalist’ movement (only asking equal rights initially) till the end of the war of liberation. One day they might find themselves not on the docks of Alger but at Ben Gurion, fleeing Palestine.

          “A binational state is actually a compromise, ask Derrida”
          The article by Adam Shatz is highly informative, as all his articles: mondoweiss.net/2012/11/a-binational-state-is-actually-a-compromise-ask-derrida.html

          Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            Wow, mondoweiss. What an authoritative source, NOT!!!

            As for the comparison with Algiers, wow!!!

            Here are some of the differences:

            1. Algiers really was just a European colony in North Africa. Israel is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people.

            2. The French of Algiers always had a place to retreat to, their home back in France. The Jews have nowhere to retreat to. Israel is our only home.

            3. The Arabs under French rule were second class citizens, by law. Israeli Arabs are equal citizens under the law except with regards to immigration policy.

            As for your comment:

            “One day they might find themselves not on the docks of Alger but at Ben Gurion, fleeing Palestine.”

            You better pray that day does not come because we the Jews of Israel have nowhere to flee. And if we would ever end up in that sort of trouble, the Middle East and it’s surroundings will have no future. Have you heard the saying “never again”? You might just want to ponder what we mean by that …

            Reply to Comment
          • BaladiAkka 1948

            “Wow. Mondoweiss. What an authoritative source. NOT !!!”
            Wow, someone who doesn’t know what a source is.
            In the two articles on Mondoweiss there is a link to the article by Adam Shatz in London Review of Books on Derrida that I mentionned. Does that mean you don’t know Adam Shatz ? And in the other, a link to Foreign Policy, and an article actually written by the pollster Shibley Telhami.
            Wow, Tzutzik just confirmed (s)he is an i…. !

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            I will make a deal with you Balad, if you accept sources like Arutz Sheva and Front Page Magazine, I may consider looking at your sources such as Mondoweiss.

            It is always the same with people like you isn’t it? It never is a case of what’s good for the goose is good for the gander is it? Because you people are specially appointed by yourselves and you have special privileges to quote whatever sources that will perpetrate your propaganda but we cannot? You are i…..ts!

            Reply to Comment
          • JG

            “2. The French of Algiers always had a place to retreat to, their home back in France. The Jews have nowhere to retreat to. Israel is our only home.”

            Aha. How comes that so many jews have another home than Israel, like France for instance?

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            Aha yourself.

            Israel has over 6 million Jews. A majority of whom never lived anywhere else other than in Israel. Which other country in the world would say to the Jews of Israel : come here, this is your home?

            Before you answer with a porky, consider this: Before WW2, just before the Holocaust, German and other Jews who were fleeing the Nazis, tried to find a sanctuary in various countries. Most were not taken in. And the number of Jews who were trying to flee in those days was much smaller.

            But here is the clincher JG. Search your own heart. Do you like Jews enough to allow us in large numbers into your own country?

            Just kidding. Don’t answer that, you might betray your hatred. In any case, we are not interested in any other country other than our home, Israel.

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            “Aha. How comes that so many jews have another home than Israel, like France for instance?”

            You got me there man …

            Just kidding … There are millions of Greek, and Italian migrants living in various other countries. Does that mean that Greece and Italy are not the homes of the Greek and Italian people?

            Reply to Comment
      • Goldmarx

        Actually, most of the Palestinian leadership in the BDS movement favor a two-state solution, reflecting the overwhelming international and UN-based consensus.

        I’m not sure what you mean by a ‘rump’ state, but given the fact that Palestinian Arabs have never been in charge of ANYTHING of significance in their history, a West Bank-Gaza state, connected via the North Sinai (for starters), that would be a hell of a lot better than anything they’ve ever had before, plus with all the settlers evacuated from their midst.

        Reply to Comment
    3. Tzutzik

      And that, ladies and gentlemen why the Israeli left has been in the wilderness for years.

      They advocate for what is good for Palestinian Arabs not for what is good for Israeli Jews who form 80% of the voting block in Israel.

      Reply to Comment
      • Y-Man

        How dare they speak up for minority rights!?! What kind of monsters are they?

        Reply to Comment
        • Tzutzik

          Yea, let them.

          But they don’t just speak up for the minority, the 20% Arab citizens of Israel. That would not necessarily be a bad thing because someone has to speak up for the minority too, as you rightly point out.

          The problem is that they speak for the enemies of Israel, the ones who want to replace the one Jewish nation state with the 23rd Muslim Arab nation state.

          In case you haven’t known this, Y-Man, the Arabs of Judea and Samaria are part of the proposed new nation, the Palestinian people, they have never been citizens of Israel. And sections of the Israeli left speak for them not for what is good for the majority of Israeli citizens. Then they wonder why they haven’t got political influence in Israel.

          Reply to Comment
          • Y-Man

            fuck identity politics, they are simply espousing justice. whether it helps the Palestinians or the Israelis is immaterial; this is a human rights matter. However you want to spin it (“only ONE Jewish state and 22 Arab ones– NO FAIR”– well that’s not the Palestinians’ fucking problem, is it), the truth is that the Israeli left is the one part of Israeli politics that isn’t basically akin to the segregationist politicians of the American South in the 1950s-60s. After all, the American South is majority white, and it was their democratic will that blacks be second class citizens– were the segregationists not trying to effect “what was good for the majority” of their citizens, who were overwhelmingly white and pro-segregation? That’s a pretty toxic criterion for successful politics in my book.

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            The truth is that you wouldn’t know what the fucking truth is if you fell over it.

            As for what is or isn’t the Palestinians problem that isn’t our problem either.

            See? Y-Man, two can play the same game. You want to be callous about our problems? Yes … ? We can be callous too about what worries you. Go fuck yourself.

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            … and the truth is that so long as the Israeli left will persist with an attitude like yours, the Israeli electorate will shun them.

            You can like it or lump it. Like you, we don’t care either.

            Reply to Comment
          • Y-Man

            it’s incredible that you see giving justice to the Palestinians as “being callous to our problems.” you haven’t specified what the problem with my “attitude” is other than I apparently want justice for Palestinians (and all people). And then you tell me to go fuck myself. Nice job, you sociopathic weirdo.

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            First of all, Yes-Man, you are the one who started using the ‘F’ word so don’t complain.

            Secondly, you claim you only want justice for the Palestinians (that word “only”) and for emphasis you come out with the following little gem:

            “(“only ONE Jewish state and 22 Arab ones– NO FAIR”– well that’s not the Palestinians’ fucking problem”

            And then you ask me to define what is so callous about your attitude?

            Are you kidding me? You show no empathy whatsoever for what we have been striving for in the last 100 years. Self determination as a people and to be allowed to live in peace in our country, as a majority and free from oppression (yes, we were oppressed by Arabs, yes even Palestinian Arabs). Read the artice by Karl Marx in the New York Herald tribune after he visited Jerusalem in 1854.

            So yes, Y-Man, I am angry at people like you for dismissing OUR rights as a people as nothing and only worrying about Arab rights.

            Oh and please don’t pretend that your tone was not angry. In fact you were the one who set that tone and I responded to it in kind, you self righteous little prig!

            Reply to Comment
          • Y-Man

            ah yes, your people are the victim. Jews have it so hard these days.

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            “ah yes, your people are the victim. Jews have it so hard these days.”

            Another mocking and ignorant comment.

            As a matter of fact yes, we too are victims. Victims to vicious Palestinian Arab terrorism. And a smear campaign by people like you.

            They are not so successful at the moment with their terrorism. I am sure you lament that but less than a decade ago they murdered and maimed thousands of us with their “heroic” intifada which was their response to Ehud Barak’s peace offer which would have given them their own state. With that, they once again demonstrated that they don’t just want their own state, they want our state too.

            Reply to Comment
          • Y-Man

            I remember when 750,000 Jews were expelled during the foundation of Palestine, and how the Palestinians are settling on private Israeli land and building a border fence encircling it, and how the Palestinians have been occupying Israel for 46 years (!), and how vastly more Jews than Palestinians have been maimed and killed over the past six and a half decades, and how the founders of Palestine admitted that they sought to ethnically cleanse the land of its inhabitants to fill it with immigrants from Europe and elsewhere. I don’t know about you, but I’d rather have a suicide bomb ten years ago than a phosphorus bomb five years ago. My heart (and the world’s heart, which is why Israel has so much popular support from the world) aches for you. I hope you’ll be okay!

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            I’ll tell you what Y-Man, I’ll dismiss your complaints the same callous mocking way that you dismiss all OUR complaints:

            Palestinian Arabs are suffered? NO FAIR”– well that’s not the Israelis ’ fucking problem” …

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            Y-Man, I think that you are the sort of person who would blame the stone for falling if someone would throw the stone upwards.

            It would not even occur to you to blame the thrower of the stone or even gravity. You would just deliver a self righteous lecture to the stone for falling.

            No wonder this world of ours is in such a mess. There are too many comprehension challenged people like you around Y-Man.

            Reply to Comment
          • Y-Man

            You are a very angry person. I hope you can get some help. I guess your nationalism is your security blanket.

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            I don’t need help. I react in kind to those who are rude to me. You want me to change?

            Respect me and I will respect you. We don’t even have to agree at the end. There is such a thing as agreeing to disagree with one another but still being respectful to each other. So far you were a failure on that score and I held up a mirror to you by behaving like you.

            You don’t like what you see? Then change! You will then see a different me …

            Reply to Comment
          • Y-Man

            How was I even rude to you? I said “fuck identity politics,” not “fuck you.” One is an attack on the political beliefs you were espousing, the other is a personal insult. You are bright enough to see the difference, right?

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            “How was I even rude to you? I said “fuck identity politics,” not “fuck you.”

            Educate yourself, Y-Man. Using the word fuck is unnecessary and rude. But hey, I use it myself sometimes as you can see, so I won’t hold THAT against you.

            I already told you why I really considered your response callous but seeing you are comprehension challenged (see? I AM being rude), I’ll tell you again. I’ll copy and paste it from my previous post, starting with the mocking callous quote of yours:

            Y-Man:“(“only ONE Jewish state and 22 Arab ones– NO FAIR”– well that’s not the Palestinians’ fucking problem”

            And then you ask me to define what is so callous about your attitude?

            Are you kidding me? You show no empathy whatsoever for what we have been striving for in the last 100 years. Self determination as a people and to be allowed to live in peace in our country, as a majority and free from oppression (yes, we were oppressed by Arabs, yes even Palestinian Arabs). Read the artice by Karl Marx in the New York Herald tribune after he visited Jerusalem in 1854.

            Do you understand now?

            Reply to Comment
          • Y-Man

            “Using the word fuck is unnecessary and rude.”
            Sorry, I didn’t mean to offend your delicate sensibilities.

            “Read the artice by Karl Marx in the New York Herald tribune after he visited Jerusalem in 1854.”
            OK, so the Arabs were bad to Jews in Palestine over 150 years ago (although I’m sure any Jew in Europe would have killed to have been in Arab lands in the 1930s and 40s). A lot has changed over 150 years. The tables have turned, completely. This fact is not even arguable.

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            “Sorry, I didn’t mean to offend your delicate sensibilities.”

            You really are comprehension challenged aren’t you Y-Man? I told you your “Fuck” word wasn’t my problem. Can’t you read? And you completely ignored what I said WAS my problem with you. You really are a stupid little man aren’t you?

            “OK, so the Arabs were bad to Jews in Palestine over 150 years ago (although I’m sure any Jew in Europe would have killed to have been in Arab lands in the 1930s and 40s). A lot has changed over 150 years. The tables have turned, completely.”

            You are off on your little tangent again. What are you smoking Y-Man?

            But a pattern is emerging. You only worry about Arab human rights but if Arabs deprive others, of human rights you just shrug it off.

            “This fact is not even arguable.”

            Everything that YOU say is arguable. You know why, Y-Man? Because you are just a biased little hypocrite. Don’t even try to preach to us. We will treat your false self righteousness the same way that you treat our complaints. We will dismiss what you say OUTRIGHT! Here let me start …

            Palestinian Arabs are suffering under occupation ? NO FAIR”– well that’s not the Israelis ’ fucking problem” …

            Reply to Comment
          • Y-Man

            God you are so boring. You’re no brilliant mind or deep thinker, but you’ve obviously been told that you are for a long time. Have a nice life.

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            “God you are so boring …”

            Yea, I know that to people like you, hearing our side is boring.

            All you are interested in is the narrative of the Palestinian Arab side. And we know why don’t we? Because you have been taught from birth that Jews have no rights like everyone else. Only you and your Arabs have rights, right Y-Man, you little hypocrite?

            Reply to Comment
          • Goldmarx

            Actually, Marx never visited Palestine. In his April 5, 1854 column for Horace Greeley’s paper, he was quoting someone else who had visited the area, French author Cesar Famin.

            Reply to Comment
          • Tzutzik

            You could be right. I don’t know. But what is your point? Are you claiming that he just repeated a lie?

            Reply to Comment
    4. Bar

      Hey, I like this format. Would 972 publish Bar’s sociopolitical outbursts on 972mag?

      Reply to Comment
      • For a modest contribution to the +972 Anarcho-Syndicalist Defense Fund, I don’t see why not.

        Reply to Comment
        • Bar

          Hahaha. I’m almost tempted. How much?

          Reply to Comment
          • Bar

            I know. ;)

            Reply to Comment
    5. These are very good. Now I’m traumatized, as I must, old fogey that I am, get a Facebook account to follow you.

      Your “WHAT HAVE THEY DONE FOR US LATELY?” is spot on. PA security cooperation with Israel is perhaps the real reason Israel will not let the PA collapse. What has to happen is that IDF abuses in the WB have to be tired to that cooperation in a negative feedback of some sort.

      Reply to Comment
      • Thank you Greg, my man! That’s all the encouragement I need.

        Reply to Comment
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+972 is an independent, blog-based web magazine. It was launched in August 2010, resulting from a merger of a number of popular English-language blogs dealing with life and politics in Israel and Palestine.

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