Comments on: The Round Trip part 10: Trapped http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/ Independent commentary and news from Israel & Palestine Sun, 19 May 2013 11:55:07 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: Leen http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/comment-page-1/#comment-57257 Leen Thu, 19 Apr 2012 09:55:18 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=42070#comment-57257 For the little debate everyone is having about Ethnic Cleansing, Ethnic cleansing is defined to be the removal of the population out of force because of their ethnic or religious identification. If there was a referendum held in areas that were to be transferred and the majority said yes, then it does not constitute as ethnic cleansing, if the population was to be transferred forcibly then it is ethnic cleansing. Population transfer is also a war crime under the 4th geneva convention. For the little debate everyone is having about Ethnic Cleansing,
Ethnic cleansing is defined to be the removal of the population out of force because of their ethnic or religious identification. If there was a referendum held in areas that were to be transferred and the majority said yes, then it does not constitute as ethnic cleansing, if the population was to be transferred forcibly then it is ethnic cleansing. Population transfer is also a war crime under the 4th geneva convention.

]]> By: Henry Weinstein http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/comment-page-1/#comment-57206 Henry Weinstein Thu, 19 Apr 2012 03:42:25 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=42070#comment-57206 The pic in the bus: great pic, Yuval. Wonder how it looks in black & white. Anyway this pic is emblematic. This serie goes far beyond travelin' writing: straight to the bone. On this pic you just look like my Dad, the few times I dared to ask him what happened to him. Before us, in Burgundy. Reminds me a pic sent to me by an Iranian friend just a few days ago. Taken in her fly back to Tehran, Khomeiny airport. In her pic everybody looks tense, like you. An image taken undercover, no trace of the photographer. The pic in the bus: great pic, Yuval. Wonder how it looks in black & white.
Anyway this pic is emblematic. This serie goes far beyond travelin’ writing: straight to the bone.
On this pic you just look like my Dad, the few times I dared to ask him what happened to him. Before us, in Burgundy.
Reminds me a pic sent to me by an Iranian friend just a few days ago. Taken in her fly back to Tehran, Khomeiny airport. In her pic everybody looks tense, like you. An image taken undercover, no trace of the photographer.

]]> By: max http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/comment-page-1/#comment-57096 max Wed, 18 Apr 2012 16:52:56 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=42070#comment-57096 TOJ, I'd call it unfair and unjust. By applying the term to events that happen relatively frequently without much complaints, you're diluting it and diminishing the attention deserved by the cases falling under - in my experience - the common usage: uprooting people from their homes. In fact, I suspect that the usage of this term in this context intends to bring up the emotional stress associated with the 'real' thing, hiding the significant difference. Damn, just checked WP and I'm right. Go figure. TOJ, I’d call it unfair and unjust. By applying the term to events that happen relatively frequently without much complaints, you’re diluting it and diminishing the attention deserved by the cases falling under – in my experience – the common usage: uprooting people from their homes.
In fact, I suspect that the usage of this term in this context intends to bring up the emotional stress associated with the ‘real’ thing, hiding the significant difference.
Damn, just checked WP and I’m right. Go figure.

]]> By: aristeides http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/comment-page-1/#comment-57094 aristeides Wed, 18 Apr 2012 16:42:54 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=42070#comment-57094 Max - that's what I'm calling it when boundaries are redrawn in order to alter the population within the boundaries to exclude an ethnic group. The population within the boundaries becomes more Arabenrein, that is the purpose, and that is ethnic cleansing. Max – that’s what I’m calling it when boundaries are redrawn in order to alter the population within the boundaries to exclude an ethnic group. The population within the boundaries becomes more Arabenrein, that is the purpose, and that is ethnic cleansing.

]]> By: the other joe http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/comment-page-1/#comment-57075 the other joe Wed, 18 Apr 2012 14:45:34 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=42070#comment-57075 @Max - I'm sorry to sound argumentative, but if you redrew boundaries a) against the wishes of the inhabitants b) in the process disenfranchising full citizens and c) condemning them to significantly worse standards of living - what would you call it if not ethnic cleansing? @Max – I’m sorry to sound argumentative, but if you redrew boundaries a) against the wishes of the inhabitants b) in the process disenfranchising full citizens and c) condemning them to significantly worse standards of living – what would you call it if not ethnic cleansing?

]]> By: max http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/comment-page-1/#comment-57073 max Wed, 18 Apr 2012 14:18:38 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=42070#comment-57073 @aristeides, you wrote "No, the plan is to redraw the boundaries solely to the benefit of Israel’s racist preoccupations and landgrabbing aspirations", nothing about ethnic cleansing. But, if you refer to "redraw the boundaries" as ethnic cleansing then we indeed talk different languages @aristeides, you wrote “No, the plan is to redraw the boundaries solely to the benefit of Israel’s racist preoccupations and landgrabbing aspirations”, nothing about ethnic cleansing.
But, if you refer to “redraw the boundaries” as ethnic cleansing then we indeed talk different languages

]]> By: aristeides http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/comment-page-1/#comment-57072 aristeides Wed, 18 Apr 2012 14:05:15 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=42070#comment-57072 Well, Max, you were replying to me, and I was talking about ethnic cleansing. Obviously, then, your posts have no relevancy, and what is clear about them is that you have no interest in dialogue. Well, Max, you were replying to me, and I was talking about ethnic cleansing. Obviously, then, your posts have no relevancy, and what is clear about them is that you have no interest in dialogue.

]]> By: max http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/comment-page-1/#comment-57062 max Wed, 18 Apr 2012 13:23:51 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=42070#comment-57062 @aristeides, I think that the discussion will be better served if you don't 'expand' my clear posts with your baseless interpretation: I haven't referred to 'shifting' population or anything that can reasonably be referred to as 'ethnic cleansing'. I only referred to redrawing borders. @aristeides, I think that the discussion will be better served if you don’t ‘expand’ my clear posts with your baseless interpretation: I haven’t referred to ‘shifting’ population or anything that can reasonably be referred to as ‘ethnic cleansing’. I only referred to redrawing borders.

]]> By: the other joe http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/comment-page-1/#comment-57061 the other joe Wed, 18 Apr 2012 13:21:24 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=42070#comment-57061 @Max - it seems like you're saying that Justice is simply whatever the strong, or those in power, or those with the biggest and most powerful guns, say it is. Might is right. . And I say pugwash. @Max – it seems like you’re saying that Justice is simply whatever the strong, or those in power, or those with the biggest and most powerful guns, say it is. Might is right.
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And I say pugwash.

]]> By: aristeides http://972mag.com/the-round-trip-part-10-trapped/42070/comment-page-1/#comment-57059 aristeides Wed, 18 Apr 2012 13:15:02 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=42070#comment-57059 Max - I get my ideas from history, mostly. Which informs me that, certainly, borders have moved throughout history and populations have been, though less frequently, shifted. So ethnic cleansing, though a new term, is an older practice. . But so what? It's still ethnic cleansing. It's still injustice and a violation of the right of self-determination of the peoples involved. . The only question is - why you seem to have a problem accepting this fact. Max – I get my ideas from history, mostly. Which informs me that, certainly, borders have moved throughout history and populations have been, though less frequently, shifted. So ethnic cleansing, though a new term, is an older practice.

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But so what? It’s still ethnic cleansing. It’s still injustice and a violation of the right of self-determination of the peoples involved.

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The only question is – why you seem to have a problem accepting this fact.

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