Comments on: Report: Fewer IDF soldiers held accountable for alleged crimes against Palestinians in 2012 http://972mag.com/report-fewer-idf-soldiers-held-accountable-for-alleged-crimes-against-palestinians-in-2012/65418/ Independent commentary and news from Israel & Palestine Tue, 22 Jul 2014 22:30:40 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.8 By: Piotr Berman http://972mag.com/report-fewer-idf-soldiers-held-accountable-for-alleged-crimes-against-palestinians-in-2012/65418/comment-page-1/#comment-107302 Wed, 06 Feb 2013 19:20:09 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=65418#comment-107302 The most important rules for a society embroiled in a conflict is to determine who is innocent (and thus, who is not) and furthermore, who is most innocent.

And nobody is more innocent than “our soldiers”. Thus attacking soldiers is always viewed as most vile and terroristic, and kidnapping soldiers more vile than, say, raping prepubescent girls (who are also innocent, but not as innocent as soldiers, for example, they may dress provocatively). For example, the operation Pillar of Something (cloud, smoke?) was preceded with attacks on soldiers.

This makes it difficult to prosecute soldiers for anything other than disobedience of orders. And it automatically reduces the severity of any transgression.

Example 1: Dilawar, a taxi driver, died after being beaten and tormented for 5 days and nights in Bagram base. Quite a few soldiers of various ranks were involved, and a black sheep provided details to the press. Ensuing investigations did not manage to exonerate everybody, so one soldier was sentenced to 2 months of jail.

Example 2: an Azeri officer, while invited to the course of English organized by NATO in Budapest killed another participant, an Armenian officer, with an axe while the latter was asleep. Since he was tried in Hungary, he was not found innocent there (not “our soldier”) and got a life sentence. After 8 years he was transferred to Azerbaijan to serve the rest of his sentence. He promptly got presidential pardon, release from prison and promotion from captain to major, to the jubilant reaction of the public.

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By: Piotr Berman http://972mag.com/report-fewer-idf-soldiers-held-accountable-for-alleged-crimes-against-palestinians-in-2012/65418/comment-page-1/#comment-107300 Wed, 06 Feb 2013 18:57:01 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=65418#comment-107300 But wouldn’t you agree that Irgun etc. were decades ahead of Palestinians in planting bombs?

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By: Palestinian http://972mag.com/report-fewer-idf-soldiers-held-accountable-for-alleged-crimes-against-palestinians-in-2012/65418/comment-page-1/#comment-107262 Wed, 06 Feb 2013 14:40:47 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=65418#comment-107262 Martyrdom bombings were generated in response to decades of oppression,humiliation and state terrorism.If you keep squeezing a balloon,it will eventually explode.
“both” is used when people dont want to condemn Israel alone,so they choose to blame “both” sides.
Equalizing the guilty with the victim? isnt only dangerous but immoral.

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By: Greg Pollock http://972mag.com/report-fewer-idf-soldiers-held-accountable-for-alleged-crimes-against-palestinians-in-2012/65418/comment-page-1/#comment-107149 Wed, 06 Feb 2013 02:46:46 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=65418#comment-107149 Palestinian, I for one will not make suicide bombings holy; nor will I make IDF actions holy. I am aware somewhat of what Israeli security did at the start of the 2nd Intifata. But I will not thereby place a garland on the bombers. This history can be pushed back by all sides leading to implacable righteousness. My point, above, is that the present incarnation of occupation was generated in response to the bombings. But that war is now over; Israel faces a policing action, not war, and has not faced that as of now. This is not an apology for Israel and the IDF, nor an apology for suicide bombing. Violence, on both sides, has made atrocity.

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By: Palestinian http://972mag.com/report-fewer-idf-soldiers-held-accountable-for-alleged-crimes-against-palestinians-in-2012/65418/comment-page-1/#comment-107067 Tue, 05 Feb 2013 14:56:38 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=65418#comment-107067 No,thats because it took Palestinians a quite a while to understand what Abd Al-Nasser said.

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By: The Trespasser http://972mag.com/report-fewer-idf-soldiers-held-accountable-for-alleged-crimes-against-palestinians-in-2012/65418/comment-page-1/#comment-107045 Tue, 05 Feb 2013 09:32:03 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=65418#comment-107045 That’s only because it took Palestinians a quite a while to figure how to build a bomb.

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By: Palestinian http://972mag.com/report-fewer-idf-soldiers-held-accountable-for-alleged-crimes-against-palestinians-in-2012/65418/comment-page-1/#comment-107041 Tue, 05 Feb 2013 09:03:37 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=65418#comment-107041 Israel’s state terrorism has started decades before Palestinian martyrdom bombings.For every action there is a reaction.

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By: Palestinian http://972mag.com/report-fewer-idf-soldiers-held-accountable-for-alleged-crimes-against-palestinians-in-2012/65418/comment-page-1/#comment-107040 Tue, 05 Feb 2013 08:58:16 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=65418#comment-107040 Surprise ! They are there to commit crimes against Palestinians , thats their full-time job.

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By: Greg Pollock http://972mag.com/report-fewer-idf-soldiers-held-accountable-for-alleged-crimes-against-palestinians-in-2012/65418/comment-page-1/#comment-106990 Tue, 05 Feb 2013 03:02:11 +0000 http://972mag.com/?p=65418#comment-106990 The occupation is now a police action, not ongoing war. One can make a claim it was something of a war during the suicide bombings, but not now. A police action which refuses to redress the occupied’s grievences as to land and livelihood has no choice but to suppress recurrent protests. Since every protest is defined as without cause, soldiers are always the victims of the protesters; they are not indicted because their jobs are pure, for the country. There are limits–a rampage soldier killing many would be addressed. But, otherwise, victimhood lies in the hard job of being a necessary soldier.

In my hope, the village creation protests are an attempt to wedge a different response from the Israeli State. So long as no plea is valid, soldiers will be mostly immune. The Court could change this by demanding redress for injuries, but without several large mistakes by the IDF I doubt such will occur. So the village protests keep offering an alternative form of engagement, unrecognized as of now.

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