Comments on: On IDF violence: My own private Lt. Colonel Shalom Eisner

By: Ziggy

Ziggy — Thu, 26 Apr 2012 01:51:33 +0000

This wasn’t a real wedding. It was an anarchist event designed to look like a wedding. This moron calls out his love for Gaza–Hamastan. Hamas in their charter call for the annihilation of all world Jewry, but shmucko here loves the place. He is fighting
“oocupation”–empty sloganeering and rhetoric.
Jews occupy the Arabs in Arab bullshit and lingo. It’s too bad this clown wasn’t really beaten badly. Kapos in the camps were beaten also. 972 mag is just an anarchist propaganda vehicle.

By: Vicky

Vicky — Mon, 23 Apr 2012 19:12:08 +0000

Haggai reported what happened to the army investigators in this article, and he explained what happened when he did. Did you read the article? It seems as though you have made the a priori assumption that 972 exists just to make Israel look bad, so you don’t really read what people write, only hunt around for ways to excuse what they write about.
.
“The fact that he’s here instead comes to show that he doesn’t really care about changing anything, he only wants publicity and money for his ‘suffering’.”
.
And the fact that he was at a Palestinian wedding in Masa’ara? As he says himself, most Israelis don’t have any contact with Palestinians – unless it’s at the other end of a Tavor. He writes about what he has experienced as a friend to those people in Ma’asara. If he didn’t care about them, he wouldn’t have been there in the first place, he wouldn’t know them at all. He certainly wouldn’t have chose to spend two years in prison rather than serving in the same army that crushes the village’s demonstrations and gatecrashes its weddings.
.
Secondly, 972 is a voluntary project. How is he going to get money by writing here? As for publicity, the personal attention you get for taking a stand like this is rarely positive. A quick glance through the comments section on Ynet or any other popular news site should tell you that.
.
“Well, I’ve shown you that its not just Israeli police, and Israel is no worse than Denmark.”
.
These were occupying soldiers who are imposing martial law on a civilian population. This situation doesn’t exist in Denmark, and the Danish climate protesters were all entitled to redress under a law that applies equally to all. Palestinians in Masa’ara haven’t got that, and their Israeli supporters are not guaranteed it either. Life in Denmark might well be nicer than life under an occupying power, but for a citizen who minds what’s going on in his/her own home it’s not that easy to walk away.
.
The opening line of your comment leaves me with the impression that you only care about victims of violence if they share your political views on Israel. If somebody challenges those views, then they must be lying, or acting out of some sinister ulterior motive, or just not deserving of any sympathy. When people start to think like this, they end up protecting their ideas at the expense of other people’s basic welfare. It’s the wrong way round – people break a whole lot more easily than ideas. Ideological hilltop settlers are never going to be my political cup of tea, but that doesn’t mean I’m going to start looking for ways to justify those soldiers who have beaten people up during outpost evacuations. Treating people with some basic kindness and respect shouldn’t be that difficult. These qualities are not at a premium in military life, and ultimately the only thing you are able to guarantee is whether or not you have them yourself. Trying to justify one person’s violence with somebody else’s violence halfway across the world is not going to help with that.

By: TLA

TLA — Mon, 23 Apr 2012 18:10:33 +0000

Vicky, I don’t care about Haggai really, his rants don’t bother me much.
.
The purpose of this whole site is to demonize Israel, and as a proof they show “Israeli police hits peaceful demonstrators”.
.
Well, I’ve shown you that its not just Israeli police, and Israel is no worse than Denmark.
.
So Haggai can go to live in Denmark if he thinks he’d be better of there, otherwise he should take his rants to the IA investigators. The fact that he’s here instead comes to show that he doesn’t really care about changing anything, he only wants publicity and money for his “suffering”.
.
Hypocrisy at its best. That’s why no-one believes you guys. Al Jazeera is more reliable than this site.

By: Vicky

Vicky — Mon, 23 Apr 2012 17:55:37 +0000

TLA,
If Ias had been hit in the face with a rifle by the Danish police, I am sure he would have complained about the Danish police. He wasn’t. He was hit in the face by an Israeli soldier, so he is complaining about the behaviour of that soldier. Haggai wasn’t assaulted while protesting at a climate summit in Denmark; he was assaulted while a guest at a wedding in Ma’asara.
.
If I am ever attacked by the police or military of any country, I would not sit around saying to myself, “It’s OK, worse happens in Tibet/Pakistan/Myanmar/insert country here.” I don’t think you would either. I also think that you would be very indignant if you were assaulted by the military whilst abroad, only for people to try and justify the behaviour of your assailant by scrutinising the record of the police and the military in your own country – as though you were somehow personally responsible for them, and deserved what you got in return.

By: TLA

TLA — Mon, 23 Apr 2012 17:46:11 +0000

Aristeides, can’t say I’m surprised to see you writing justifications for suicide bombers, but then again – this whole site serves one purpose: justifying terror. Not that you’re doing a good job, you guys are so obvious in your lies that its ridiculous.

By: TLA

TLA — Mon, 23 Apr 2012 17:44:40 +0000

Nice link I’ve got here for you: Police beating a peaceful protester… With a stick, nonetheless!
.
Guess where?
.
Yes, IN DENMARK!
.
Watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=FOih0OVwTfU#t=85s
.
Stop bashing Israelis for what your own police does much worse.

By: aristeides

aristeides — Fri, 20 Apr 2012 21:05:34 +0000

My problem with the suicide bombing narrative is that it invariably is raised in a context of exclusively Jewish trauma, as if the Palestinians under the occupation haven’t suffered far more extensively and at least a traumatically.

.
Also that the Jewish victims of the bombings seem to be in total denial of the reasons behind the intifada, clinging instead to “just because we’re Jews.”

By: Greg Pollock

Greg Pollock — Fri, 20 Apr 2012 07:31:46 +0000

ps
.
Paul, above, it totally right, in my view.

By: Greg Pollock

Greg Pollock — Fri, 20 Apr 2012 07:28:57 +0000

Coming from a family Jim Crow background, I can assure you that when due process fails in an instance such as this, it fails in instances of greater harm, silently. The Syria comparison is simply a way of asking us to voluntarily shut our eyes. Once shut, well, nothing happens.
.
Anna,
.
There is great fear and anger in Israel. I recall a story about an old black woman marching with others toward a police line. She is purported to have said, “Don’t be mad at them, they don’t know what’s going on and are afraid.” Well, I made the words up, but you get the drift.
.
The suicide bombings were horribly real. If the left trys to pretend they weren’t–it will backfire. How you incorperate those events in a narrative of hope has yet to be done, or has yet to be adequately heard, at any rate.

By: Vicky

Vicky — Thu, 19 Apr 2012 22:51:30 +0000

“Does this melodramatic text, possibly very upsetting to a real rape victim, say something about the literary freedom the author has assumed?”
.
I recognise the feeling that Haggai was referring to with the parallel: he was in a position where he was injured, bleeding, and vulnerable, dependent on others to help him, and they took advantage of their power and his vulnerability. I did wince and feel disturbed when I read the comparison to rape, because the truly awful thing about rape (at least as I have experienced it) is not how you feel at the time, but how you feel afterward – as though your body isn’t your own any more, and nothing you do will make you feel safe in it again. I would have preferred it if Haggai had used a different metaphor, but I don’t see how his description of his emotional state calls into question the factual accuracy of his description of events. While I don’t think that rape should be used to mean anything other than rape, I also don’t think that it is right to try and use rape victims (or murdered Syrians, for that matter) to undermine or deflect attention from this article’s point: brutality within the army, and the lack of accountability.