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10,000 protest in Tel Aviv for a just peace, end to occupation

Under a coalition of Israeli left-wing political parties and organizations, thousands gathered in Tel Aviv’s Rabin Square in the largest anti-war demonstration since the outbreak of violence in Gaza.

(Moriel Rothman-Zecher and Haggai Matar contributed to this report)

Some 10,000 Israelis flooded Tel Aviv’s Rabin Square under the slogan “Changing direction: toward peace, away from war” in the largest anti-Gaza war demonstration in Israel since the outbreak of hostilities more than one month ago.

Thousands gather at a pro-peace rally in Tel Aviv, calling for a just peace and an end to violence in Gaza, Tel Aviv, August 16, 2014. (photo: Activestills)

Thousands gather at a pro-peace rally in Tel Aviv, calling for a just peace and an end to violence in Gaza, Tel Aviv, August 16, 2014. (photo: Activestills)

The protest was scheduled to take place last week, but was postponed after the police and Home Front Command revoked its permit, ostensibly to stop large gatherings during a time when missiles were being fired at Tel Aviv and other Israeli cities. Roughly 500 non-aligned activists flooded Tel Aviv’s Rabin Square anyway, in defiance of the ban.

The major left-wing parties, including Meretz and Hadash, as well as Peace Now and other left-wing organizations, joined tonight’s demonstration, calling for a wide range of demands, from continuing negotiations between Israel and Hamas to an end to the occupation and Israel’s blockade of Gaza. Many who have demonstrated throughout the past weeks of hostilities expressed disappointment at Meretz and Peace Now for their refusal to support anti-war demonstrations until now.

Meretz MK Zehava Gal’on addressed the protest, affirming that her party was against the Israeli military operation in Gaza all along. She lashed out at Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu for not immediately recognizing the Palestinian unity deal and instead choosing war.

To large applause, Hadash MK Mohammad Barakeh stated in Hebrew and Arabic, “We are building a partnership against the occupation, for a free Palestine.” He continued, “We are here for a two-state solution, for life and a future for people in Gaza and the South.”

Famed Israeli author David Grossman addressed the large crowd, saying, “We won’t be able to breathe deeply in Israel as long as people in Gaza feel choked,” adding, “We will always be neighbors with people in Gaza. We must live together.”

David Grossman speaks to a crowd of 10,000 anti-war protesters in Tel Aviv, August 16, 2014 (photo: Activestills)

Israel author David Grossman speaks to a crowd of 10,000 anti-war protesters in Tel Aviv, August 16, 2014 (photo: Activestills)

Naomi Tzion, a resident of Sderot, called on the crowd to think of those in Gaza who have now been made refugees twice or thrice, adding, ”The true spitting in the face of the residents of Sderot? The attempts to paint us all as a single stereotyped collective.” Gaza is “the biggest jail in the world,” she continued.

Along with anti-war sentiment, protesters expressed their anger at the Israeli government for its lack of leadership, chanting “Bibi, go home!”

According to the protest organizers, the demonstration was organized to send the following message to Israel’s political leaders:

The next round of fighting can be prevented. No to the way of wars – we must have a political solution! After an agonizing month of war and death, in the face of mounting waves of incitement and hatred, which increasingly tear up the Israeli society, we stand up to demonstrate for peace and for democracy.

The rally at Rabin Square came two days after another demonstration was held to express solidarity with the residents of communities along the Gaza border.

Related:
Hundreds in Tel Aviv defy police ban to protest Gaza war
The night it became dangerous to demonstrate in Tel Aviv
‘No more deaths’: Thousands of Israelis protest the Gaza war

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  • COMMENTS

    1. Tomer

      Just 10,000 leftist idiots only?

      Maybe their numbers were slightly rounded up and even then many were Israeli Arabs. So maybe just 5000 Leftists turned up. Well, some mentally-challenged loons and self hating crazies turned up.

      Reply to Comment
      • Felix Reichert

        You were there, then?

        Reply to Comment
        • Gustav

          “You were there, then?”

          I know you ard trying to be funny, playing on words. But Felix, you are not funny. Pay attantion even though you are finding it hard: only Arabs and a handful of one eyed leftists like you were there.

          Reply to Comment
          • Ray

            I don’t think he’s “playing on words.” He’s literally asking you if you were there. As in, so we know whether or not your description of the protesters was accurate.

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            “Well, some mentally-challenged loons and self hating crazies turned up.”

            He did not have to be there to know that Israeli Jews who protest against their own state rather than Hamas, or at the least, against Hamas equally, fit the above description.

            As for Israeli Arabs, their protest on behalf of their fellow Arabs is a bit more natural even though equally misguided because they too should be trying to put pressure on Hamas not to use Gazans as cannon fodder for a misguided shortlived political gain.

            But I still think, Felix was trying to be a smart ass by suggesting that if Tomer was there then he could be accused of fitting his own description of the demonstrators. I could be wrong though. Felix? Are you still there? Speak up for yourself. Don’t let the likes of me put words in your mouth.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            Why protest against Hamas when Israel started this recent escalation by breaking the truce with Hamas?

            * Israel bombed Hamas infrastructure in Gaza as early as the 14th of June (third day of Brother’s Keeper).

            * Hamas only responded by firing rockets into Israel on July 8th, almost one month later.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            The rockets on June 8th were, by the way, followed by a unilateral truce proposal the day after, June 9th.

            Which Israel ignored.

            Then came the Israeli/Egyptian unilateral truce proposal, and everyone with high moral standards and no double-standards at all blamed Hamas for continuing the escalation by rejecting it.

            Ver

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            That should have said July 8th and July 9th, of course.

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            Oy vey Felix,

            You are all over the place. And when you are cornered with facts, you just invent lies.

            There is no arguing with people like you.

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            On another thread I already forced you to admit that the rockets from Gaza came first. Your only feeble excuse was that Hamas wasn’t the one firing the rockets but some other terrorist group. Here is that thread, Felix.

            http://972mag.com/debunking-gaza-war-lies/95124/

            But now you are just changing your story again? Typical! These are the lies and the liars that Israel constantly has to face. You people, yes people like you Felix, have no shame.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            I never claimed there weren’t any rockets before Brother’s Keeper. They just didn’t come from Hamas, as many Israeli analysts will confirm.

            Show me one, ONE instance of an Israeli official that claims Hamas shot any rockets directly before July 8th.

            One.

            Then I might start taking you serious.

            I’m sorry you’re wrong, I’m sorry to shatter your worldview. But that’s what happens when you’re faced with the facts.

            So back to those facts:

            Why did Israel bomb Hamas infrastructure, when the rockets from Gaza were not fired by Hamas?

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            I have another question for you, Gustav:

            Would the British government have been justified in bombing Dublin (or some towns across the Northern Irish border) in the 70s, just because the Irish government couldn’t get the IRA under control?

            Would it have been okay for them to bomb schools, churches, and government buildings?

            I mean the Irish government was responsible (at least in part) for the IRA terrorism, according to your logic.

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            “Would the British government have been justified in bombing Dublin (or some towns across the Northern Irish border) in the 70s, just because the Irish government couldn’t get the IRA under control?”

            Not only would they have been justified but they would have reacted more harshly than Israel acted against Gaza.

            But of course, you just came out with a meaningless silly hypothetical because Northern Ireland didn’t attack British civilians with thousands of rockets over a 15 year period. Nor did they murder and maim thousands of British civilians with wave upon wave of suicide bombers as they murdered Israeli civilians between 2000 and 2006 till Sharon put an end to it by harsh measures.

            You as a German, Felix, should know what the Brits would have done had they had to put up with what Hamas dished out to Israel, just ask your grand parents what they remember about the firebombing of Dresden.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            Might not have been thousands, but “only” hundreds of rockets and mortar shells that sometimes flew over the Irish/Northern-Irish border. And hundreds of civilians and especially military personell was killed by IRA terrorists.

            Many of these terrorists hid in Ireland, across the border.

            And exactly how many bombs did Britain drop on Ireland in reaction?

            How many? Tell me again?

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            “Might not have been thousands, but “only” hundreds of rockets and mortar shells that sometimes flew over the Irish/Northern-Irish border.”

            No Felix, none of the rockets or mortars were shot from a sanctuary like the Republic of Ireland. And if they would have been, the Republic of Ireland would have stopped it. Did Hamas stop the rockets from Gaza? Of course not.

            Now, did you speak to your grandparents about what the Brits did to Dresden in WW2? If you would, they would tell you that the Brits fire bombed Dresden and literally erased it from the map. There were hundreds of thousands of your fellow Germans who died or were maimed.

            You know why the Brits did that to you guys? No? Then I will remind you. Your uncle Hitler sent his rockets onto Britain and what do you know, the Brits didn’t appreciate it.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            Yes Gustav. You are wrong. Many rockets and mortar shells were fired across the Northern Irish border from the republic of Ireland.

            It wouldn’t hurt if you did your research and actually knew what you were talking about, before commenting.

            “25 November 1973: The IRA shot dead two patrolling British soldiers at Rossville Flats, Derry.[61] Six rockets and heavy gunfire hit Belleek RUC base, County Fermanagh. The attack came from the other side of the border.”

            (Just one example)

            “In addition to traditional gun-running, the insurgents sniped from the safety of Eire, planted bombs that could be detonated from across the border, and sent units over for hit-and-run operations.”

            In other words: there were plenty of cross-border attacks.

            Also, the Blitz killed over 40 thousand British, not counting the many other British people that were killed in Nazi bombings.

            How many Israelis died from rockets out of Gaza?

            DO you even know what the fuck you’re talking about? Apparently not.

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            I have done my research Felix. Have you done yours? Are you aware that unlike Hamas, the Republic of Ireland cooperated with Britain? Here read this:

            “Ireland maintains a stated policy of neutrality, however the nation has a sizable military. The Óglaigh na h-Éireann , or Irish Defense Forces, have two dedicated intelligence and security divisions. The G-2 military intelligence branch collects and analyzes both foreign and domestic intelligence. The agency often aids other European nations and the United States in international intelligence operations. G-2 provides intelligence information on terrorist organizations associated with the Northern Ireland conflict, often cooperating with British intelligence at MI5. G-2 is one of Europe’s most sophisticated intelligence agencies, conducting remote, computer systems, signals, and human surveillance.”

            Is that what Hamas does with Israel? Of course not. Not only they shoot rockets at Israel whenever it takes their fancy but they allow the likes of Islamic Jihad to shoot rockets then they try to pretend that what Islamic Jihad does is not their responsibility.

            Unlike the Irish Republic who actively tried to control what happens from within their borders, in cooperation with the British, Hamas only gets it’s voice when Israel takes matters into it’s own hands. Then they try to claim cease fire violations by Israel even though time and time again, rockets come out of Gaza first.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            Now you’re really starting to grasp at straws, Gustav.

            How relevant and on point of you to post a quote from an Irish website that describes the situation TODAY, when we were talking about the situation in the 70s, or 40 YEARS AGO.

            Seriously? I mean like… what?

            And Hamas DID in fact previously “cooperate” with Israel, at least indirectly. By succesfully curbing, or often actually completely stopping rocket attacks by other militant groups, like in 2013.

            On July 8th, when Hamas actually responded to Israel’s braking of the truce, they fired more rockets in one day then were fired (not by Hamas!) from Gaza in the whole year 2013.

            As many Israeli officials were forced to admit, publicly.

            What exactly does that show you? Explain it to me, come on.

            “Not this old chestnut again. There were 7 to 9 million dead Germans at the end of WW2. Are you going to claim therefore that Nazi Germany was right just because they had more dead than the Brits? No of course you didn’t. But that’s what you are trying to do to Israel because Israel killed more in the war which like Nazi Germany did, Hamas wants and continues to want.”

            Actually, YOU started this argument by claiming that what Hamas does today is so much worse than what the IRA did in the 1970s (and 80s, and 90s), by adding up the victims.

            And yes, wanting freedom and national self-determination for Palestinians IS RIGHT. Israel IS WRONG, in almost every regard when it comes to its dealings with the Palestinians.

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            “Now you’re really starting to grasp at straws, Gustav.”

            I am? Then let me prove you wrong.

            “How relevant and on point of you to post a quote from an Irish website that describes the situation TODAY, when we were talking about the situation in the 70s, or 40 YEARS AGO.

            Seriously? I mean like… what?”

            It is very relevant because as usual, you are wrong. MI5 and G2 (Irish intelligence) have a history of cooperation going back to WW2. Don’t believe me? Then read this:

            http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directorate_of_Intelligence_(Ireland)

            Go to the heading “History” in that link. This is what it says:

            “The G2 spent much of its early efforts combating the Anti-Treaty IRA, in the Republic of Ireland, and also operated in Northern Ireland.[9] ”

            “And Hamas DID in fact previously “cooperate” with Israel, at least indirectly.”

            Indirectly, huh? To get what it wanted out of Israel, like the release of 1 captive Israeli soldier in exchange for 1027 Hamas terrorists, many of whom had the blood of Israeli civilians on their hands.

            “By succesfully curbing, or often actually completely stopping rocket attacks by other militant groups, like in 2013.”

            Really? How did they do that? Just give me a link to a reliable site which tells us how many renegade rocket firers they killed or even just arrested? Just one reliable link, Felix, is that too much to ask?

            “On July 8th, when Hamas actually responded to Israel’s braking of the truce, they fired more rockets in one day then were fired (not by Hamas!) from Gaza in the whole year 2013.”

            I and Bar already debunked this assertion of yours. We posted links which show that rocket fire was directed at Israel from Gaza before your above date. Just keep on studiously ignoring it but reasonable people who read our posts pick up on your bluster.

            “As many Israeli officials were forced to admit, publicly.”

            The only thing they admitted was that when it suited Hamas, the truces held temporarily.

            “What exactly does that show you? Explain it to me, come on.”

            Look above, come on. It shows that when it suits Hamas, they keep the truce. And when it suits them to break truces, they break it.

            “Actually, YOU started this argument by claiming that what Hamas does today is so much worse than what the IRA did in the 1970s (and 80s, and 90s), by adding up the victims.”

            Not really. You were the one who brought in the Irish analogy (look back) I actually disputed that the Irish situation was anything like the one between Israel and Hamas.

            “And yes, wanting freedom and national self-determination for Palestinians IS RIGHT. Israel IS WRONG, in almost every regard when it comes to its dealings with the Palestinians.”

            Whatever. You don’t have to reiterate your unreasonable extreme pro Palestinian Arab bias, we are already aware that you are one eyed.

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            “Also, the Blitz killed over 40 thousand British, not counting the many other British people that were killed in Nazi bombings.

            How many Israelis died from rockets out of Gaza?”

            Not this old chestnut again. There were 7 to 9 million dead Germans at the end of WW2. Are you going to claim therefore that Nazi Germany was right just because they had more dead than the Brits? No of course you didn’t. But that’s what you are trying to do to Israel because Israel killed more in the war which like Nazi Germany did, Hamas wants and continues to want.

            As for the rockets, they were scary enough for European and American airlines to turn tail at a mere hint of danger to them in the latest round of rocket attacks when one rocket destroyed a house near the Israeli international airport.

            You ask how many Israelis died or were maimed by Hamas? Here is a statistic about the second intifada, by the UN:

            “Of those killed in the conflict, 4,228 have been Palestinians, 1,024 Israelis, and 63 foreign citizens. For every person killed, approximately seven were also injured.”

            Not enough dead and injured Israelis for you Felix?

            Reply to Comment
          • Pedro X

            Instead of bombing areas, the British government carried out clandestine killings of Catholics in Northern Ireland. The British had a force, the Military Reaction Force, which carried out extra judicial killings against Ireland’s Catholic population. It forces carried out drive by shootings of civilians. More than 3,000 deaths are being investigated by detectives from the Historical Enquiries Team.

            The British also armed Protestant para-military forces to do their killing.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            For how long was this “Military Reaction Force” active, and how many people did it actually kill extra-judicially?

            Look it up, you may get some perspective.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            And just to call out some of your lies and misinformation:

            In the Second Intifada, between roughly 650 and 780 Israeli civilians were killed. Not “thousands”.

            The Provisional IRA may not have attacked Britain with thousands of rockets and mortar shells, but at least a couple of hundred, terrorizing British civilians not over a 15 year period, but over a 28 year period.

            Rockets and mortar shells that, I might add, did way more damage in Northern Ireland than all the Palestinian rockets from Gaza did in Israel combined.

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            “In the Second Intifada, between roughly 650 and 780 Israeli civilians were killed. Not “thousands”.

            I said, maimed and killed. I stand by that. Thousands of Israelis were maimed and killed, look it up.

            If you don’t understand words like “maimed” then go to English classes or refrain from posting on English speaking sites.

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            It is really a simple concept. Hamas took over Gaza. It is therefore responsible for law and order in Gaza. So if someone fires rockets out of Gaza at civilians, it is their job to stop it. It is also in the interest of Gazans.

            If Hamas can’t or won’t, then Israel has every right to do what is necessary to try and stop it itself. Not only the right, but the duty.

            Reply to Comment
          • Misfar Hassan

            This is a positive step by those who were bold enough to come out in support of peace
            Some loon here has taken it as against the state without realising that peace is not only in the best interest of regional but international peace

            Reply to Comment
          • Kiwi

            @Hassan

            What do you have to say about the following report?

            “The report, delivered during a panel discussion, was based in turn on reports by Palestinian sources, translated by Channel 10′s analyst. The demonstrators reportedly blamed Hamas for the destruction of the neighborhood, and Hamas’s response was to kill them all immediately. Asked how the demonstration could have come about in the first place, the analyst speculated that there could be other pockets of resistance that would emerge.

            A fellow panelist observed that throughout the war, not one leader from Hamas had emerged to represent the group in public. “I haven’t yet seen a single shot of a Hamas man in the Gaza Strip” in news reports, he said.”

            That’s why there are no 10,000 people demonstrating in Gaza against Hamas’s war.

            Reply to Comment
      • Wim Vincken

        In Israel there is still a democracy and if people wants to demonstrate, that’s their basic right.

        Reply to Comment
    2. Pedro X

      “The next round of fighting can be prevented. No to the way of wars – we must have a political solution!”

      Maybe the protestors should have marched in Gaza City and stood up and demonstrated for peace and for democracy. Hamas was not listening.

      Today, Hamas rejected the Egyptian peace proposals. Here is Hamas’ answer to peace proposeals:

      “We are continuing our struggle. ALLAH IS OUR GOAL, THE PROPHET IS OUR LEADER, JIHAD IS OUR WAY, AND DEATH FOR ALLAH IS OUR MOST EXALTED WISH”

      All the marching and singing of peace songs will not change the mind of fanatics who believe the way to paradise is jihad and the killing of Jews.

      Reply to Comment
    3. bar

      By all means! Let’s “end the occupation” so we can have a war every two years with the Palestinians in Judea and Samaria and get lectured by the world about “human rights violations” in these wars. Great plan!

      Reply to Comment
      • Jan

        nsttnocontentcomment

        Reply to Comment
      • Jan

        So what is your plan Bar? Do you want to keep having war after war until one day there will be no more wars because there will be no one left?

        Or do you want to do what Hitler tried to do to the Jews? You know, the Final Solution. Is that what you really want in your heart of hearts Bar?

        Reply to Comment
        • bar

          I want peace, Jan.

          Only a fool who believes the stupid propagandists who support the Palestinians would assume that pro-Israelis want anything else.

          Are you a fool, Jan?

          Reply to Comment
          • Ray

            Deep down, we expect you really would like all the Arabs ethnically cleansed from “Greater Israel.” But we know you’ll settle for peace… strictly on Israeli terms, with Israel still having the power to dictate conditions.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            So why aren’t you more critical of the Israeli government, which provoked and started this recent escalation by breaking the truce with Hamas?

            Reply to Comment
          • Guy L.

            I’d like to answer that question. Just read Tayya’s comment below to get an idea.
            As long as people are wanting to free Palestine “from the river to the sea”, I won’t criticize my government from trying to stop them.

            I realize that it’s not as catchy- but if pro palestinian protests were chanting “from the river to the 1967 borders, Palestine will be free”, I’d probably be chanting right with them.
            But- they’re not. The majority of the activists I’ve met and spoken with strive and fight for a single Palestinian state from the river to the sea. I find it hard to support this because, well- I kinda sorta live in that area, and I’d like to stay there.

            Reply to Comment
          • bar

            “Deep down, we expect you really would like all the Arabs ethnically cleansed from “Greater Israel.” But we know you’ll settle for peace… strictly on Israeli terms, with Israel still having the power to dictate conditions”

            You see, Jan? This is the type of bullshit propaganda to which you listen and upon which you rely. Are you a fool, Jan?

            Felix wrote: “So why aren’t you more critical of the Israeli government, which provoked and started this recent escalation by breaking the truce with Hamas?”

            You see, Jan? Some more propaganda for you to swallow. Isn’t it amazing?

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            Let me ask you a simple question Bar, what happened first this year:

            Israel bombing Hamas infrastructure,
            or Hamas shooting rockets at Israel?

            If you’ll claim that Hamas fired any rockets first, I’d love to see your sources.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            Ahem… none of these claim that any of the rockets before July 8th were fired by Hamas. None.

            The Ynet article doesn’t even mention Hamas.

            You can read and understand English, right?

            So I’ll ask you again:

            What happened first this year,
            Israel bombing Hamas infrastructure,
            or Hamas shooting rockets at Israel?

            Reply to Comment
          • Kiwi

            Ahem

            What is it you guys always tell to everyone ? ….

            Something about how Hamas was democratically elected? Yes, Felix? And therefore Hamas represents the people of Palestine?

            Now Felix, a democratically elected party is responsible for everything that happens within the areas which they control. Especially rocket fire.

            They can’t just selectively shut their eyes to whoever fires rockets from areas which they (Hamas) controls and pretend that it isn’t happening. Otherwise things will happen to them in return, know what I mean?

            Think about this Felix. If Hamas is able to summarily execute Palestinians who demonstrate against them for bringing the war on Gaza, then they should be equally capable to stop pretend renegades from shooting rockets on Israeli civilians. And if they don’t then as Gustav said above, Hamas are just as responsible for the breaking of the cease fire, as the pretend renegades who started shooting at Israel first.

            Promise me that you will try to assimilate that simple fact, Felix dear.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            I still have not seen one credible source about the alleged execution of demonstrators in Gaza.

            Please guys, provide one.

            And of course Hamas should try and stop rocket attacks from Gaza. Which they did, as good as they could (considering they couldn’t even pay their personell for months). Even Israeli officials credited Hamas for succesfully curbing rocket fire from Gaza. More than once.

            Guys, please. Do your research.

            Reply to Comment
          • bar

            Um, the article and the Wiki article replete with links to sources answer your question. If you’re still unsure, why don’t you call the Hamas propaganda office and ask them which ones they fired and which ones their partner groups fired. Also, you can ask them whether they control Gaza or whether whenever it suits their supporters (aren’t you ashamed?) they want to distance themselves from rockets fired at Israel from their territory across a sovereign border.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            If the sources are there and so easy to find, I’m sure you can provide ONE, one little source that confirms your claim, Bar.

            One.

            Please post the link in here, directly. Because I sure as fuck can’t find anything. I’m sure you can do it, after you succesfully made a fool of yourself and posted that Ynet link that didn’t even mention Hamas.

            Come on. One link. I’m sure you can do it.

            Reply to Comment
          • Kiwi

            Sure Felix, I can punch you in the nose with my left hand and when you come after me, I will look at you innocently and say, hey man, take it easy, my left hand had a spasm, my right hand was trying to hold my left hand back but this time it didn’t work.

            You are a fool and you think the rest of us are fools too. I’ll say it again. If rockets come out of Gaza, Hamas is responsible. They sure as hell are good at killing anyone whom they don’t like. People whom they call collaborators, Fatah and crowds who demonstrate to criticise them. On the other hand, show me just one rocket firing so called renegade whom they arrested, let alone killed.

            Oh and I almost forgot. Hamas was the one who refused to have even a humanitarian cease fire at least once in this latest round. Was that the fault of renegades too? They made it conditional on the lifting of the siege. Kinda like threatening to cut their nose off to spite their face. Only it wasn’t Hamas’s nose, just the noses of ordinary Gazans.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            Kiwi, if you really, REALLY do not want to make a huge fool of yourself any further, I’m sure you can provide me with one, ONE credible source as to the killing of demonstrators by Hamas.

            And of course you can also provide one, ONE source that claims that Hamas “left hand” (who is that even supposed to be?) fired any rockets before July 7th/8th.

            Come on guys. Can’t be that difficult.

            Oh, and by your logic the Israeli state is directly responsible for every crime in the state of Israel. Am I right, or am I right?

            So a person whose, let’s say spouse is murdered in Israel can hold the State of Israel directly responsible, right?

            Just explain your infallible logic to me.

            And oh, I forgot. Hamas offered Israel a ceasefire directly after it fired its first rockets on July 8th. Which Israel completely ignored, therefore effectively refused. That proposal did, by the way, NOT include the the condition of a lifting of the siege.

            Later they (AND Islamic Jihad) offered Israel a 10-year (!!!) truce. Which Israel also ignored.

            Reply to Comment
          • Kiwi

            Sigh, ok Felix, don’t believe me. But do you believe the BBC? This is what they wrote:

            “Most of the rockets fired before June appear to have been fired by smaller militant organisations. Hamas has in the past clamped down on those, when it was in its interest to do so.

            But not only has Hamas condoned attacks when it suited it. It is also wary of being seen as “Fatah II” – a reference to the notion that Fatah became Israel’s de facto enforcer by agreeing to end violence and arrest those continuing with violence without the guarantee of a Palestinian state.”

            Or are you going to accuse the BBC of pro Israel bias?

            Reply to Comment
          • bar

            I provided multiple sources. You have two links, both of which are sources and then the Wikipedia article receives its information from outside links. All you need to do is click on them. You know enough about using a computer to post comments here, so you know enough to go to those links and click. Enjoy.

            Reply to Comment
    4. JohnW

      Hamas’s excuse for the rockets is the blockade. But the fact is that the blockade itself is Hamas’s fault.

      When Hamas ousted the PLO in 2007, they clearly said that they will not abide by the agreements signed at Oslo by the PLO.

      One of those agreements was not to import additional weapons. And since Hamas clearly gave a signal that they WILL be importing more advanced weapons to improve the effectiveness of their current primitive rockets which they never stopped firing on Israeli civilians since 2001, Israel would have been out of it’s mind if it would oblige Hamas and lift the blockade completely.

      By the same token, Jewish Israelis who demonstrate against Israel for the recent fighting, are insane. All they do is encourage Hamas to keep doing what they have been doing for years. WAR MONGERING and using the media to get political mileage out of the suffering of their own people!

      Reply to Comment
      • tayyabah

        What a mess steal land for 60 yeats and then state we have right to exist on stolen land, the billions that are send to the illegal state Israel can retrive the occupier back and let the 60 millin Palestinian refugees return to their home town,,,,,, just a ploy

        Reply to Comment
      • Felix Reichert

        And when exactly did the Israeli government(s) ever abide by the agreements in Oslo?

        Reply to Comment
    5. cheryl guillot

      Free Palestine

      Reply to Comment
      • Kiwi

        Free people of their myopia and anti Jewish prejudices and hatreds.

        Only after that, will they be able to assist the prospects of peace and maybe even a free Arab Muslim Palestine alongside a safe and secure Israel, a nation state of the Jewish people.

        Reply to Comment
    6. Very happy so many turned out in the spirit of peace and solidarity with Palestinians. There may be hope for us after all.

      Reply to Comment
    7. A.F.

      Yes, thank you JohnW for speaking truth. The people of Gaza who want peace with Israel must rid themselves of their terrorist gov’t before peace can be achieved. How could Israel open borders when all Hamas and their followers do is conspire for the destruction of Israel and for the death of all Jews? These are not people who want to negotiate even remotely for a peaceful resolution with Israel. Israel does not benefit from war with Gaza, it is in their best interest to have peace with Gaza, and to in general not have people wanting them dead or trying to kill them. How do you suggest they negotiate peace with people who teach their children to hate and kill Jews, who openly admit they will never recognize Israel? Additional thought, I hope the Israeli’s at this rally observing their democratic right to publically organize and criticize their Gov’t realize they wouldn’t have that or many other rights in Gaza, or else face public beating and/or execution.

      Reply to Comment
    8. Felix Reichert

      Oh Steve, I seem to have hit you hard with my little poem. Or else you would not have reported it to Facebook to get it deleted.

      So here we go, good luck getting it deleted this time:

      Ode to Steven

      As though conjured by magic spells of yesteryear /
      soon in our midst a very sad and obnoxious troll will appear.
      He’ll circumvent the argument and post a many trollish links /
      to rightwing sites and other racist bile that stinks.
      Under every article he’ll post and say the same /
      to him it seems to be some kind of game.
      With no regard for human decency and no civility /
      his element of choice seems to be hostility.
      He’ll only try to offend, insult and to provoke /
      ever since his Zionist Gestapo membership was revoked.

      Right after we have called him out /
      He will call Chuck an asshole, and myself a Kraut.

      His name of course is Steven Plaut.

      Reply to Comment
      • Gustav

        Felix

        Now I have a question to ask you too. Call it a return of compliment.

        Are you one of those people who is desperate to show that Jews are not just victims but they are evil too? So they kinda deserved what they got? Are you desperate enough to try so hard to prove that proposition that you would be willing to stoop to lies, exaggerations or oversimplified analogies?

        One has to wonder what are your motives for being so desperate in your quest? I think a dozen psychoanalysts would have a field day analysing you.

        Reply to Comment
        • Felix Reichert

          Sure. Jews are evil.
          My flatmate especially, who I’ve lived with for more than six years. Man, I really hate her…

          Stop making a fool of yourself.

          Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            An oldie but a goodie.

            “Some of my best friends are Jews”

            Try another one Felix. This excuse is worn out. Your desperation to smear the Jewish state and making excuses for the enemies of the Jewish people, defines you for those of us who care to look and call you out. Your claim about whom you associate with, ah, not so much.

            Reply to Comment
          • Felix Reichert

            Your desperation to smear the Arab people and the Palestinians is worn out, and is working less and less around the world. Racist bigots like you will lose this war, and soon.
            Not much longer until the Israeli economy is being boycotted around the world.

            Everyone who wants to save the Jewish state, wants to have peace for Jews and Arabs, must critisize Israel’s policies, loudly and clearly. More and more Jews around the world are coming to the same conclusion.

            I’m really sorry for you. You’re not only on the wrong side of history, but also of morality.

            Reply to Comment
          • Gustav

            You are being hysterical Felix. I am not on the wrong side of history. Hamas is as were the Nazis in Germany. Both those organisations and you have one thing in common, hatred of Jews.

            Wanna know how Hamas is on the wrong side of history? Read this:

            http://www.worldtribune.com/2014/07/31/sources-hamas-quickly-puts-dissent-gaza-kills-palestinian-protesters/

            “GAZA CITY — Hamas has been shooting Palestinians to quell unrest in the Gaza Strip. Palestinian sources said Hamas has been killing Palestinians suspected of sparking protests amid the war with Israel. They said more than 50 people have been killed, most of them accused of spying for Israel.

            Hamas fighters
            “Everybody is terrified to talk about this because they still control the streets,” a source said.”

            And that’s the group whom you constantly make apologetics for, Felix. Even their own people, the ones who voted for them back in 2006, are turning against Hamas now. But I am on the wrong side of history?

            You are funny, Felix in a sick kind of way.

            Reply to Comment
    9. Kiwi

      “Kiwi, if you really, REALLY do not want to make a huge fool of yourself any further, I’m sure you can provide me with one, ONE credible source as to the killing of demonstrators by Hamas.”

      Gustav already did, go look at his latest post. Now here is one from me about how Hamas violated humanitarian laws when it ousted Fatah in 2007:

      http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Gaza_(2007)

      “These attacks by both Hamas and Fatah constitute brutal assaults on the most fundamental humanitarian principles. The murder of civilians not engaged in hostilities and the willful killing of captives are war crimes, pure and simple.” ”

      —Sarah Leah Whitson,

      Middle East director for Human Rights Watch.[32]

      And here is another one where Hamas executed so called collaborators:

      http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/nov/20/hamas-executes-informants-israel-gaza

      “Masked gunmen publicly shot dead six suspected collaborators with Israelin a large Gaza City intersection Tuesday, witnesses said. An Associated Press reporter saw a large mob surrounding five of the bloodied corpses shortly after the killing.”

      It just proves that Hamas knows how to mete out it’s disgusting brand of justice on those whom they don’t like. Have you seen any reports which claim that they tried to stop those who break cease fires with Israel when Hamas does not want them to do it? If not why not? If yes, please post a link which verifies your claim, Felix.

      “And of course you can also provide one, ONE source that claims that Hamas “left hand” (who is that even supposed to be?) fired any rockets before July 7th/8th.”

      Yep. Those links were posted already on this very thread and other ones. It just suits you to deny reality. That’s your problem of course, not mine. Others can see the game that you are playing.

      “Come on guys. Can’t be that difficult.”

      No it can’t look at what we all posted already and stop denying reality.

      “Oh, and by your logic the Israeli state is directly responsible for every crime in the state of Israel. Am I right, or am I right?”

      Of course you would be right. It is the Israeli state’s responsibility to uphold the law and punish those who break it. That means, for the sake of argument, that if some renegade Israeli group would fire rockets on Gaza, it would be the state’s responsibility to stop them. Or if they couldn’t prevent it, then at least to punish the perpetrators so that there would be deterrence.

      Has Hamas done that with those in Gaza who shot rockets against Israel during cease fires? Of course not. But if you disagree, then come on Felix, give me a link to a reliable site which verifies your claim. Can’t be that difficult.

      “So a person whose, let’s say spouse is murdered in Israel can hold the State of Israel directly responsible, right?”

      Yes, if the state does not do it’s duty to catch and punish the perpetrator. Otherwise no.

      “Just explain your infallible logic to me.”

      My infantile logic? At least I have logic, Felix. You on the other hand demonstrated yourself to be totally clueless.

      “And oh, I forgot. Hamas offered Israel a ceasefire directly after it fired its first rockets on July 8th. Which Israel completely ignored,”

      Really? Most others would ignore cease fire offers immediately after the other party demonstrates for the umpteenth time that they constantly break cease fires.

      “therefore effectively refused. That proposal did, by the way, NOT include the the condition of a lifting of the siege.”

      Yes but this is how it works with Hamas;

      1. Let’s have a cease fire.

      2. Sometimes later, Hamas or their cronies unilaterally break the cease fire.

      3. Israel eventually, after many rockets, retaliates.

      4. Hamas sometimes then agrees to a cease fire and expects Israel to immediately follow suit.

      5. If Israel agrees, Hamas or their cronies then proceed to break the cease fire again, often within a day or so.

      And so it goes.

      “Later they (AND Islamic Jihad) offered Israel a 10-year (!!!) truce. Which Israel also ignored.”

      Yep, but that included the demand to end the blockade. Israel would be stupid to agree to that unless Hamas would agree to inspections. Otherwise they would use the Hudna to arm themselves to their teeth and subsequently attack Israel from a position of strength.

      In fact, if I would be an Israeli decision maker, I would expect Hamas to renounce their much publicised aim to destroy Israel before I would be willing to take the pressure off Hamas.

      Reply to Comment
    10. Hamas doesn’t see a peaceful future. They thrive on war and killing!!!

      Reply to Comment
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